[Kdenlive-devel] Czech manual

Sun Aug 1 10:53:08 UTC 2010

Hi,
userbase.kde.org looks too simple for such complex documentation like
Kdenlive certainly is. So far I tried to find page which has subpages,
however I was not successful - I tried about 10 of pages and there were
"all-in-one-page". Please can you show me where it is different?

Jan D.

2010/8/1 Yuri Chornoivan <yurchor at ukr.net>

> Simon Eugster <simon.eu at gmail.com> wrote
> > Would anyone object to switching to wikibooks now?
>
> Maybe it is worth to consider UserBase ( http://userbase.kde.org )?
>
> It is closely related to KDE, it has translation (both offline and online)
> capabilities (TranslateWiki extension), and automatic docbook generation
> capabilities (in development) for offline documentation.
>
> >
> > As I've seen, we don't have an offline documentation anyway. Or am I
> > mistaken? When clicking the menu entry Help > Kdenlive Handbook I get
> > redirected to http://kdenlive.org/user-manual. Which is mainly at the
> > state of 2008.
> >
> > @Hugh: I would wote «Pro» for GSoC.
> >
> > Simon
> >
> > 2010/7/20 Jan Dr?bek <me at jandrabek.cz>:
> > > Hi,
> > > in my opinion, installed help is considerable after having some
> > > documentation which was revisited by users, heavily used and cover
> whole
> > > Kdenlive (it looks like utopia now). Creating only online accessable
> > > documentation will certainly upset some people, but most of today users
> have
> > > good internet connection - so I see it acceptable.
> > >
> > > Structure is of wikibook is linearized (I have not been so courage to
> make
> > > it structured) so I attach also non-linearized version which I
> originally
> > > used in my work.
> > >
> > > Jan Dr?bek
> > >
> > > The original structure:
> > >
> > >
> > > Introduction
> > >
> > > What this book is about, and for users it is
> > > Terminology
> > > Typographics conventions
> > >
> > > Before start
> > >
> > > Introduction, what can it do
> > > Dictionary
> > > History and present
> > > Development
> > > Installation
> > >
> > > Gentoo
> > > Debian
> > > Fedora
> > > Ubuntu
> > > OpenSuSE
> > > Mandriva
> > > ArchLinux
> > > FreeBSD
> > > MacOS
> > >
> > > First project and recording
> > >
> > > First run
> > > Introduction with user interface
> > >
> > > Project structure
> > > Monitors
> > > History (undo)
> > >
> > > New project
> > >
> > > Project settings
> > >
> > > Video recording
> > >
> > > Video4Linux
> > > Firewire
> > > Screen recording
> > >
> > > Timeline and first cut
> > >
> > > Timeline and its tools
> > >
> > > Timeline
> > > Selection
> > > Cursor of timeline
> > > Cut
> > > Spacer
> > >
> > > First cut
> > >
> > > Cut from beginning/end
> > > Fade in/out (audio)
> > > Add translation
> > > Basic settings of translations
> > >
> > > Translations and effect
> > >
> > > Translations
> > >
> > > Keyframes
> > > Default translations
> > >
> > > Effect
> > >
> > > Handling effects
> > > List of effects
> > >
> > > Orientation in project, other types of clips
> > >
> > > Useful smallness
> > >
> > > Guides
> > > Markers
> > > Split view (monitor)
> > > Working with tracks
> > > Group clips
> > >
> > > Different types of clips
> > >
> > > Color clip
> > > Generated clip (noise, countdown)
> > > Slideshow
> > > Subtitles
> > >
> > > FInishing project
> > >
> > > Render
> > >
> > > Timeline selection
> > > Render form
> > >
> > > Creating DVD
> > >
> > > Advanced functions
> > >
> > > Batches
> > > Reencoding
> > > Project cleaning
> > > Managing project profiles
> > > Downloading new lumas files
> > > Managing rendering profiles
> > >
> > > At the end
> > >
> > > Other materials
> > > Other video editors
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > 2010/7/20 Hugh Tebby <hugh.tebby at gmail.com>
> > >>
> > >> Hi,
> > >>
> > >> Considering the installed help, I'm not sure it should be a criteria
> for
> > >> choosing the online documentation system. The help could just send
> users the
> > >> the online documentation, like what is done in Blender for instance.
> Having
> > >> links to online documentation, video tutorials and the forum should be
> good
> > >> enough.
> > >>
> > >> The main issue with the documentation is covering the whole app and
> (most
> > >> of all) keeping it up to date. A wiki seems to me like the best
> solution,
> > >> and the most common. The Blender wiki is quite good I find :
> > >> http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Main_Page
> > >>
> > >> We should really decide what structure to give to the user manual and
> then
> > >> have one documentation which could be translated to other languages.
> > >>
> > >> Jan, could you provide a translation at least of the titles of your
> > >> wikibook ? It would help understand and discuss (and hopefully enhance
> !)
> > >> the structure.
> > >>
> > >> Also in order to maybe get a stronger community we could have a look
> at
> > >> OpenShot, or Krita. OpenShot actually started building a community
> before
> > >> the app was available ! (via Facebook for instance). One thing that is
> great
> > >> about OpenShot and Krita is that their websites are also development
> blogs.
> > >> Krita has a weekly development summary which is a great read, and
> Openshot
> > >> has regular updates for enhancements and new features.
> > >>
> > >> Could Kdenlive (or maybe MLT...) also participate in the Google Summer
> of
> > >> Code next year ? A couple of full time devs would make quite a
> difference !
> > >> Recently Krita had a fundraising in order to pay one of their devs
> full time
> > >> for several months in order to optimize and stabilize the app, and it
> worked
> > >> great ! I would certainly be willing to throw in a couple of dozens
> dozens
> > >> to get two or three months of full-time Kdenlive development ! (but I
> > >> suppose that also means finding a developper that has a few months of
> spare
> > >> time...)
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Anyway, just a few thoughts !
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Cheers,
> > >> Hugh
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> 2010/7/20 Simon Eugster <simon.eu at gmail.com>
> > >>>
> > >>> 2010/7/19 Yuri Chornoivan <yurchor at ukr.net>:
> > >>> > написане Mon, 19 Jul 2010 05:13:44 +0300, Dan Dennedy
> > >>> > <dan at dennedy.org>:
> > >>> >
> > >>> >> On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 2:21 PM, Till Theato <root at ttill.de>
> wrote:
> > >>> >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > >>> >>> Hash: SHA1
> > >>> >>>
> > >>> >>> On 07/18/2010 07:19 PM, Jan Dr?bek wrote:
> > >>> >>>> Hi,
> > >>> >>>> I have just finished putting my Kdenlive manual (in czech) into
> > >>> >>>> wikibooks (I
> > >>> >>>> mentioned that I wrote it as my secondary school leaving project
> in
> > >>> >>>> forum).
> > >>> >>>> So now czech manual is complete, visible and searchable from
> google
> > >>> >>>> and I am
> > >>> >>>> going to update it regulary.
> > >>> >>>> Feel to browse it on address
> http://cs.wikibooks.org/wiki/Kdenlive
> > >>> >>>>
> > >>> >>>> I am wondering if it would be possible to add a visible link to
> > >>> >>>> kdenlive.orgdocumentation page mentioning this complete manual
> for
> > >>> >>>> czech users.l (I did
> > >>> >>>> this on czech community pages)
> > >>> >>>>
> > >>> >>>> Thanks
> > >>> >>>> Jan Dr?bek
> > >>> >>>
> > >>> >>> Hi,
> > >>> >>> I don't understand the language but it seems to feature quite a
> lot.
> > >>> >>>
> > >>> >>> There recently have been discussions about moving the
> documentation
> > >>> >>> back
> > >>> >>> to a wiki, so maybe we could you use wikibooks for all languages.
> > >>> >>> I will post this thread in our forum, so hopefully we will be
> able to
> > >>> >>> set up a better documentation in a few more languages (or at
> least in
> > >>> >>> English, too).
> > >>> >>>
> > >>> >>> @jb: Where would you like the documentation to be placed? Our
> current
> > >>> >>> Drupal system doesn't seem to be the best solution.
> > >>> >>>
> > >>> >>> regards till
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >> Keep in mind that some people expect and use installed help as
> well.
> > >>> >> Most wiki-based documentation systems do not make it convenient to
> > >>> >> output XML to support that. For Kino, I enhanced a wiki that uses
> > >>> >> docbook XML as a backend and could perfectly export to installed
> help.
> > >>> >> It also supported multiple languages, but the big downside is that
> it
> > >>> >> only supports ISO-8859-1 and not UTF-8! It might be worthwhile for
> > >>> >> someone leading documentation to look into these this aspect of
> it. If
> > >>> >> the options are still not good, then some documentation regardless
> of
> > >>> >> installable or not is better than none.
> > >>> >>
> > >>> >
> > >>> > Hi!
> > >>> >
> > >>> > In fact, we have similar problems with KDE UserBase. Burkhard L?ck
> > >>> > created
> > >>> > the script [1] that can easily convert wiki export data to KDE
> docbook.
> > >>> > You can see the exported Parley manual on docs.kde.org [2]
> (glitches
> > >>> > are
> > >>> > due to docs.kde.org problems, not the problems in docbook itself,
> > >>> > locally
> > >>> > it looks good).
> > >>> >
> > >>> > I have just tried it on wikibooks pages (English and Czech in
> UTF-8)
> > >>> > and
> > >>> > it seems that the script works fine. Thus wiki -> KDE DocBook
> > >>> > conversion
> > >>> > can be done with the minimal efforts.
> > >>> >
> > >>> > Best regards,
> > >>> > Yuri
> > >>> >
> > >>> > [1]
> > >>> >
> > >>> >
> http://websvn.kde.org/branches/work/doc/parley/wiki2docbook.py?revision=1141465&view=markup
> > >>> > [2] http://docs.kde.org/development/en/kdeedu/parley/index.html
> > >>>
> > >>> I think a good manual is very important for kdenlive:
> > >>> 1 There are often quite basic questions on the IRC and in the forums.
> > >>> 2 It would make users more aware of kdenlive
> > >>> 3 It would show how many possibilities you have.
> > >>>
> > >>> To the last point, I for example did not know that you could set
> > >>> in/out points of clips when they are still in the project list until
> > >>> there was a bug report in mantis about this.
> > >>>
> > >>> To point one, recent questions were e.g.: How do I cut two clips at
> > >>> the same position? How can I render just a piece of the video? What
> is
> > >>> the difference between the project profile and the render profile?
> How
> > >>> do I get transparent titles?
> > >>>
> > >>> The current solution was a good attempt, and it would have been great
> > >>> if it had worked, but unfortunately it did not:
> > >>> http://kdenlive.org/user-manual
> > >>>
> > >>> Switching back to wikibooks might have the advantage of a larger user
> > >>> base that is already registered. But could we still export then?
> > >>> The second advantage is the Czech manual that already is there.
> > >>>
> > >>> Would there be big disadvantages of using wikibooks?
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> Another thought, we need a stronger community. Perhaps we should have
> > >>> a direct link to the forums in the title navbar on kdenlive.org?
> (Imho
> > >>> it is a little bit hidden atm; most users will expect it to be
> there.)
> > >>> Having a stronger community would also decrease the waiting time for
> > >>> answers in the forum, increase the number of tutorials, etc. We need
> > >>> some community expert :)
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> Just my thoughts.
> > >>>
> > >>> Simon
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
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> > >>
> > >>
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