Better default toolbar setting

[Stefan Monov]

> >> "Check mail" is just one icon, and it's probably one of the most
> >> obvious icons in a mail client toolbar. Why you want to hide it?
> > 1. the less icons, the better (all other things equal)
> > 2. it'll enable me to claim that icons don't need text under them
>    3. it'll make room for the "Make this thread die" button?
>
> Luckily the icon will be easy to understand and won't need text under
> it, as it consist of a recursive animation of the user deleting this
> thread only to have another mail about it show up, which the the user
> deletes, after which another mail about it shows up, which the user
> deletes, after which... oh hell, you get the idea.
http://docs.kde.org/stable/en/kdepim/kmail/filters.html
(sigh)

Inâki,
> > > "Check mail" is just one icon, and it's probably one of the most
> > > obvious icons in a mail client toolbar. Why you want to hide it?
> > 1. the less icons, the better (all other things equal)
> I think you can choose any other icon to hide it instead of the "check
> mail" icon.
This is not a reason to keep "check mail".

> > (on that note, you haven't answered that yet: If the Oxygen
> > get/reply/forward icons are indeed easily distinguishable, then do we
> > need text under them?)
> Ok, these icon are very good, but, could be all the icons so easily
> distinguishable?
I personally believe that they can. Can you give an example of a pair of icons 
that can cause confusion?
(I'm asking this for the fifth time or so)

> > the user shouldn't choose when to check mail in.
> Why??? there have been in this thread a lot of good examples of cases where
> any user can need to check mail manually:
>
> - Receiving something important e.g. by someone you are communicating
> real-time via IM or phone.
> - Signing up somewhere.
> - In mobile use, when one just wants to check for new mails and do
> nothing else, turn on notebook, check mail, shutdown.
You haven't been listening at all, have you?

"Receiving something important e.g. by someone you are communicating
real-time via IM or phone." / "Signing up somewhere." - solution: set mail 
interval to 60s.

"But people don't know how to set the interval" - solution: a) make first tip 
say "you set the interval by doing..."; b) make the option more visible; c) 
make the default interval 60s

"But people on low bandwidth want to check manually" - solution: they can add 
the icon to the toolbar easily.

"In mobile use, when one just wants to check for new mails and do
nothing else, turn on notebook, check mail, shutdown." - solution: the "Check 
on startup" option

> I think it's obvious that there are good reasons to have a
> "check mail" icon by default
Erm, that's funny, to me it seems that nobody has given a single one yet.

> Do you know any mail client without that button??
I've used only Mozilla Thunderbird before and it did have the button. I would 
take a guess that at least 99% of GUI mail clients do have the button.
Still, that's no reason for KMail to have it.

Roberts,
> I use check mail in occasionally when I'm expecting an email, so I don't
> think it should be removed. 
Why don't you decrease the checking interval?

> As for text under icons, why not just have an option in kpersonalizer
> (first-run wizard) to let the user decide which style they want?
I had completely forgotten about KPersonalizer :) .
Yes, that's a great idea really. Of course, we want to keep KPersonalizer as 
uncluttered as possible (to avoid scaring newbies), so we shouldn't jump 
right at it, but if the outcome of this debate happens to be that there 
cannot be a good compromise between beauty and easiness (for toolbars), I'm 
all for adding the option to KPersonalizer.