[KDE/Mac] Fwd: Article: Slackware Developer Not Happy With KDE5 Development

[Ian Wadham]

Hi Mario,

On 28/10/2014, at 10:55 PM, Mario Fux wrote:
> Am Dienstag, 28. Oktober 2014, 11.18:45 schrieb René J.V. Bertin:
>> On Tuesday October 28 2014 09:54:49 Mario Fux wrote:
>>> on Windows and Mac and almost everywhere. People work on what they use
>>> themselves, mostly in the free software world, it's a bit different in
>>> the corporate work.

Well, I think that needs to change a little in the KDE world, as it did in the
corporate world from about 1967 onwards.  The truth is that there are crowds
of people out there who are using KDE desktops and Linux, not to mention
hundreds of thousands of Brazilian schoolchildren IIRC…  Then there are
guys like us on Mac and Windows who like the KDE applications…

KDE development is no longer a barnstorming exercise à la "Great Waldo Pepper"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Waldo_Pepper.  KDE is now a large aircraft,
with a LOT of passengers.

>> Yup, very true, at least for myself. Which is part of why I won't be doing
>> substantial work on KF5 until it becomes the environment I can do the rest
>> of my work in. Unless I start getting paid to do so ;)
> 
> Would be nice to have some paid KDE Mac developers. Are you searching 
> actively?

Hmmm, my nest egg is getting a little low, thanks to the GFC and low interest rates… ;-)

>>> software and it's new for KDE core developer that there is a KDE software
>>> on Mac movement so it needs time to work best together. But I think
>>> you're on a great path.
>> 
>> Yes. We on our end do tend to make the apparently erroneous assumption that
>> KDE chose to use Qt in order to be cross-platform …

Funny that, when I started to develop KGoldrunner (c. 2000), Qt being cross
platform was the main attraction for me, since portability is a major software
quality IMHO.  Without it, what would UNIX and compiler languages ever
have achieved?  Even now, I must confess, I try to use non-portable features
of KDE as little as possible and as tightly encapsulated as possible in my code.

> Might be. But I'd prefer to change "on our end" to "in our group". You're not 
> at one end of KDE. You're part of KDE. A relatively new and young one but 
> important one nonetheless.

Put away the violin, Mario… :-)  Go and read the sad tale of
https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/120431/, which ended happily, but only after
I threatened to break every rule in the book…  And here I was trying to fix
something that was no longer confined to OS X users, but was potentially
affecting every KDE 4 installation in the world…  Two weeks later, I am still
unwinding after nearly having a nervous breakdown.

Moral: The "relatively old" groups of KDE can be *very* unwelcoming and it
does not help that they are obsessed with KF5 to the exclusion of all else.

OTOH, I do see that Marko, René and I are at last being treated with some
respect (in spite of that "Screw OSX" remark in the aforementioned review),
but it has taken *months* of constant struggle and conflict.  This is not the way
for a group to attract "(wo)man power".

>>> Oh and go and take a look what masses of (KDE) code landed in Qt5. We
>>> upstreamed so much.

Much of it was the very same parts of KDE that I *did* use in my apps I am happy
to see… :-)

>> I know, but once again that was done without feedback from platforms other
>> than Qt/X11 on Linux.
> 
> That's simple to answer as well. If there are no Win or Mac developers in 
> KDE at a certain time they can't give feedback. That changes now and Marko 
> already blocked a KF5 release from the Mac side (there, real feedback from 
> real people ;-) and you're and other here are actively working on KDE code and 
> discussing stuff.

No, the KDE community needs to become PRO-ACTIVE.  It needs to go out and
GET opinions and ideas, not just depend on whoever happens to be around.

How is it possible to find out what the requirements are for a Mac or Windows
version of KDE if you do not go and talk to some knowledgeable people?  The
MacPorts developers, for example, have been around almost as long as KDE has.

And the same goes for attracting good people to work on KDE.  Conduct surveys.
Put on a "road-show" to visit universities and colleges, especially perhaps in
India, China and Brazil, where there are loads of talented people just busting
for a chance to make a mark in software and advance their opportunities in life.

My 2c.

All the best, Ian W.