Australian representative?

Daniel Stone daniel at
Mon Jul 7 08:59:04 BST 2003

On Mon, Jul 07, 2003 at 09:41:31AM +0200, Lauri Watts wrote:
> On Friday 04 July 2003 14.17, Daniel Stone wrote:
> > Hi guys,
> > Sirtaj (taj at k.o), has been in Delhi for quite some time, and will
> > continue to be, instead of in Australia. Because of this, he got changed
> > to an Asian representative, rather than the Australian rep. This means
> > we've got no-one left in Australia!
> >
> > Around the time my -c-d post access was revoked, 
> Due to your own bad behaviour including an apparent inability to make a post 
> without filling it with swearing and ad hominem attacks.

That is the reason, yes. I don't stand by those posts I made. I have
privately explained some of the reasons behind them to a couple of
developers - reasons, not excuses.

I agree that my behaviour at the time was unacceptable, and warranted
removal of my -core-devel posting status, and can see why my
representative status was revoked; I'm kind of surprised I didn't lose
my @k.o, too.

> > my status as a .au 
> > representative also got revoked by a member of the web team. 
> s/member of the web team/active and valued developer/ 
> After having been added arbitrarily, and removed not without at least tacit 
> and some cases explicit approval by many other people.  

My addition was by no means arbitrary; it was discussed in a
kde-core-devel thread, and no objections were raised in the matter of a
couple of days.

> > I handled a 
> > few cases, and did so quite well, IMHO; as it stands, we have no
> > representatives for a country of 19 million, so I'm perfectly willing to
> > go back on the list, if there are no objections.
> And if there are objections?

Then it's up to the discretion of the developers; if they're major
objections, or if there are a couple, I won't bother - if there are
none, obviously no-one sees any problem with it.

> Daniel, you seem to have the idea that I dislike you personally.

In all my dealings with you, I've gotten grudging and cold replies, if
anything; however, this is a matter to be solved in private mail, and
I'll continue it off-list.

> This isn't 
> true. I've tried to come up with a way to say the following politely, and 
> this is the best I can do.  
> I don't think your behaviour historically on these very-publicly archived 
> lists and other public forums is the kind of behaviour I wish to see 
> identified as 'representative of KDE.'  I think we have some time to go 
> before you've earnt back the goodwill you may have had previously with many 
> of us.  I think KDE is currently better off without an Australian 
> representative at all, than one who has a public persona that could cause us 
> to be taken less than seriously.

I can see where you're coming from here, again, and you have a very
valid point. However, I don't think there is any danger of a repeat of
my previous -core-devel behaviour, and I certainly never acted that way
when representing KDE to others. Of course, had I been aware -core-devel
was archived, I certainly would've acted differently, but that's again
another matter altogether.

I take it you're raising an objection; all I can hope is to try and
change your mind. I personally think that the best way to win back the
trust of you guys is to act flawlessly as a representative. I've tried
to do much of the same by participating constructively and calmly on
kde-core-devel (witness my posts since I started getting moderated -
only one has been rejected, since it was an issue I ironed out with
coolo on IRC; admins, correct me if I'm wrong) - there has been no
flamage, not even any that got to moderator stage and then got rejected.

Winning back one's trust is pretty difficult, when all avenues to do so
are closed off; all I'm asking is for another chance to act in a
capacity I acted reasonably well in before I was hit with personal


Daniel Stone                                              <daniel at> - -
"Configurability is always the best choice when it's pretty simple to implement"
  -- Havoc Pennington, gnome-list
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