Plasma Mobile Development meeting notes

[Bhushan Shah]

On Fri, Apr 8, 2016 at 6:26 PM, Bhushan Shah <bhush94 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Here is log for Plasma Mobile Future development meeting on 8th April 2016.

Those were minutes and log is attached in this one.

-- 
Bhushan Shah

http://bhush9.github.io
IRC Nick : bshah on Freenode
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[13:31:03] <bshah> mgraesslin, bshah, apol, ahoneybun, sebas, notmart, alexl, kbroulik, colomar, jensreu
[13:31:07] <mgraesslin> o/
[13:31:08] <sebas> I'm here
[13:31:09] <bshah> meeting time..
[13:31:12] <notmart> here
[13:31:20] <sebas> slijkhuis: ^
[13:31:21] <apol> bshah: hello
[13:31:25] <jensreu> Here with coffee + grand ideas
[13:31:37] <sebas> get your Jens-shields out!
[13:31:44] <jensreu> :D
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[13:32:37] -*- bshah misses kbroulik, colomar
[13:32:51] <colomar> I'm here
[13:34:00] <bshah> okay, so main topic of this meeting is to decide further development topics of Plasma mobile, and little bit on current status..
[13:34:14] <kbroulik> hello
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[13:35:09] <bshah> Currently we have Plasma mobile shell and few applications like dialer, spacebar, phonebook, which are designed to run in any base operating system
[13:35:36] <bshah> As well as there is KWin/Wayland stack which handles graphics.
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[13:36:21] <-> akreuzkamp is now known as akreuzkamp_away
[13:36:22] <bshah> current reference system for Plasma mobile is Ubuntu touch, we are reusing the Ubuntu touch xenial images by removing unity8/mir stuffs and installing our own stuff
[13:36:23] <apol> and discover to install the rest? :D
[13:36:27] <bshah> yes..
[13:36:50] -*- ahoneybun did not know there was xenial images
[13:36:55] <sebas> is discover working on the phone now? (last time I checked there were layout problems)
[13:37:03] <bshah> sebas: yes, it is working
[13:37:17] <bshah> ahoneybun: yes, there are images but experimental
[13:37:20] <sebas> cool, in devel? (because, right now upgrading is broken, right?)
[13:37:26] <bshah> yes
[13:37:45] -*- ahoneybun can't wait for builds for N7
[13:37:51] <bshah> now main problem currently is, ubuntu touch focus on vivid stack, while xenial stack is not working
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[13:38:25] <bshah> so.. recently we have started to investigate new base, which is Cyanogenmod + Neon/Debian in container
[13:38:42] <notmart> ok, so the big elephaint at the moment is "how we get a working stack again"
[13:39:03] <bshah> yes.. well we have working stack if I consider 3 month old backed up image
[13:39:11] <bshah> err 2 month
[13:39:19] <sebas> question: I see that the flash command now refers to neon, that has been switched?
[13:39:24] <sebas> ubuntu-device-flash --server="http://neon.plasma-phone.org" touch --channel="neon-mobile/devel" --bootstrap --developer-mode --password 1234
[13:39:33] <slijkhuis> yes I'm here
[13:39:35] <bshah> yes, its just channel name change
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[13:39:46] <sebas> ok, but otherwise everything's the same?
[13:39:50] <bshah> yes
[13:39:58] <sebas> cool, thanks
[13:40:35] <notmart> yeah, but we really need new stuff to move forward (would like qt 5.6 for instance)
[13:40:47] <sebas> yep
[13:40:55] <bshah> I've very good results so far with CM + Ubuntu in chroot, for instance libhybris tests passing
[13:40:59] <sebas> that's also holding back switching the dependency to Qt 5.6, right?
[13:41:10] <sebas> (which could force users to have e.g. multiscreen problems fixed...)
[13:41:12] <bshah> currently I am investigating on getting kwin to work..
[13:41:24] <sebas> bshah: ah, good progress ... awesome
[13:41:27] <notmart> nice
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[13:41:33] <mgraesslin> bshah: if there is any way for me to help with that let me know
[13:41:44] <notmart> yeah, we need 5.6 also for the desktop, that's being blocked by plasma mobile
[13:41:45] -*- mgraesslin has some experience with getting kwin started on phones for the first time
[13:42:15] <bshah> Okay, so what this meeting is basically for sorting what needs to be done to get useful plasma mobile
[13:42:39] <sebas> so the plan is to:
[13:42:45] <bshah> What applications and essentials we are missing currently? decide todo items and move forward with it
[13:42:46] <sebas> - get new bootstrap working
[13:42:51] <sebas> - get kwin working
[13:42:59] <sebas> - move to Qt 5.6
[13:43:09] <sebas> - test the shit out of it and stabilize the base
[13:43:16] <sebas> - add more features
[13:43:17] <sebas> ?
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[13:43:26] <bshah> pretty much yes
[13:43:44] <sebas> I'd love to get the phone repos into a stable release for 5.7, we've been slacking a bit on that
[13:44:00] <sebas> and then add a channel stable perhaps, that would be possible, right?
[13:44:04] <notmart> essentials i think atm the part of phone itself/adress book is very, very primitive
[13:44:07] -*- mgraesslin hopes for QT 5.6 not having surprises like Qt 5.5
[13:44:13] <notmart> (don't know how/if relates to spacebar)
[13:44:31] <sebas> so devel and devel proposed stay, and stable builds from the  stable git branches
[13:44:34] -*- ahoneybun has a paste.kde.org up
[13:45:02] <bshah> but, while there is work undergoing for mobile stack, I would love to get new features done in parallel, I've been trying to get ubuntu touch based image working
[13:45:10] <sebas> notmart: yup, but I think we want a stable baseline to improve on those features, makes tracking regressions way easier
[13:45:20] <notmart> yes
[13:45:23] <bshah> sebas: yes, it is possible to get stable images
[13:45:30] <sebas> good
[13:45:33] <bshah> ahoneybun: ?
[13:45:46] <ahoneybun> bshah, just writing notes
[13:46:04] <bshah> ahoneybun: ah okay
[13:46:05] <sebas> so let's concentrate on bootstrap / kwin and Qt 5.6 first, once we have that, critical look and create a stable channel?
[13:46:05] -*- ahoneybun quiets down
[13:46:16] <bshah> sebas: +1
[13:46:43] <bshah> another item : is our todo board: https://phabricator.kde.org/project/view/28/
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[13:47:22] <sebas> for the TODO board, if everybody could have a look at the items with his name and update them ...?
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[13:47:40] <mgraesslin> done :-P
[13:47:42] <notmart> one thing i would get things clear: how that todo board relates with the one i did for kirigami
[13:48:02] <notmart> and yes, the items with my name on it still in todo actually depend from kbroulik :p
[13:48:04] -*- sebas has scope and functionality requirements though, that can't really be any more vague ... I'll give it some thinking
[13:48:07] <ahoneybun> sebas, for some of those items would it be a bad idea to look at the ubuntu touch apps and take ideas?
[13:48:17] <sebas> it's pretty important to define where we want to go, to concentrate on these things first
[13:48:18] <ahoneybun> kmail = dekko for ex
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[13:48:38] <mgraesslin> s/kmail touch/kube?
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[13:48:41] <sebas> ahoneybun: for that, I'd actually like to use kube
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[13:48:51] <colomar> Definitely kube for mail
[13:48:52] <sebas> kube devs are buying in as well to this idea
[13:49:06] <ahoneybun> kube?
[13:49:09] <colomar> Given that they use kirigami and are getting their designdirectly from jens and me
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[13:49:12] <bshah> in my experience with getting ubuntu touch apps working with our stack its too hard.
[13:49:12] <notmart> yes, it also means something big not on our plate..
[13:49:17] -*- sebas updates that task
[13:49:19] <notmart> ..provided we are supportive to them
[13:49:26] <colomar> To whom?
[13:49:33] <notmart> kube people
[13:49:42] <colomar> Um...
[13:49:48] <colomar> Jens and I meet with them every week
[13:49:55] <colomar> So I guess we have that front covered ;)
[13:50:07] <sebas> colomar: how far on the priority list is kube with phone UI?
[13:50:11] <sebas> +up
[13:50:15] <jensreu> Yes so we are supportive :)
[13:50:20] <notmart> yeah, that's good, some of us should as well tough
[13:50:30] <ahoneybun> heyo jensreu
[13:50:35] <colomar> You help Michael with is kirigami questions, don't you notmart?
[13:50:39] <notmart> as far i understood phone ui had less priority than desktop tough
[13:50:45] <bshah> there are lots of things from ubuntu touch that can be reused, but they have different UI and HIG then ours (i.e Kirigami)
[13:50:46] <jensreu> ahoneybun: heyo!
[13:50:47] <notmart> colomar: yep, absolutely
[13:51:05] <colomar> mbohlender said he is quite happy with kirigami so far, btw :)
[13:51:11] <jensreu> notmart: I am sure they would like to have some technical back and forth concerning the Phone and Kube.
[13:51:17] <notmart> that's cool
[13:51:28] <slijkhuis> Ubuntu UI is extremely user unfriendly.
[13:51:49] <ahoneybun> sebas, https://notes.kde.org/p/3SgVcdHiAs
[13:52:08] <sebas> ahoneybun: awesome, keep those notes going
[13:52:09] <colomar> sebas: About the priority: Desktop is definitely higher on the official prio list, but mbohlender is already working on mobile mostly in his free time
[13:52:22] <sebas> nice, I suppose ... kirigami?
[13:52:33] <sebas> out of interest: is Android / iOS a target, too?
[13:52:40] <notmart> slijkhuis: yeah, to mee it seems to have been designed in an echo chamber without much input from outside, so became something that looks quite cool, but tends to fail with real users
[13:52:53] <sebas> "I want to be different"-UI
[13:52:56] <Sho_> notmart: btw at some point we need to add radio button support to MenuItem
[13:53:00] <jensreu> sebas: for Kube? Yeah
[13:53:09] <colomar> sebas: Yes, kirigami! And yes, Android and iOS are a target (higher prio than Plasma Mobile, actually)
[13:53:11] <sebas> nice.
[13:53:15] <notmart> Sho_: what's MenuItem?
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[13:53:23] <sebas> colomar: surprising (the higher priority)
[13:53:24] <mgraesslin> makes sense that that's a priority for them
[13:53:30] <Sho_> notmart: sorry, PlasmaComponents.MenuItem
[13:53:44] <mgraesslin> sebas: kolab use cases, I doubt you can market with use k9mail :-P
[13:53:48] <sebas> sure, and probably plasma mobile is way easier to target, given buildsystem headaches on android and ios
[13:53:54] <slijkhuis> @notmart, I've used Ubuntu for 1 month, and it is terrible, if you want your OS to be a global success, keep it simple, and clean. the developers of Ubuntu Touch were thinking too much 'in the box' i guess.
[13:53:54] <Sho_> notmart: It's used in conjunction with PlasmaComponents.ContextMenu
[13:54:04] <notmart> Sho_: ah, ok, kinda unrelated to current meeting so, we can talk about that later
[13:54:14] <colomar> With kirgami, I guess Plasma Mobile comes pretty cheap once you have Android running, though
[13:54:15] <ahoneybun> slijkhuis, the sandbox you mean?
[13:54:23] <Sho_> notmart: (ug sorry I didn't read backlog and didn't notice ongoing meeting)
[13:54:31] <sebas> colomar: yes, not just kirigami, but also the whole buildsystem and dependency stack
[13:54:44] <sebas> for plasma mobile, it's probably "yet another app to package"
[13:54:46] <slijkhuis> ahoneybun, the overal experience sucked. getting to the phone, switching apps, the whole thing is extremely unfriendly.
[13:54:58] <sebas> but let's see its birth first, then drool
[13:55:23] -*- notmart would soo much love some more help/feedback/teamwork on kirigami on the development side tough (collaboration has been fantastic on the design side so far)
[13:55:28] <slijkhuis> give the phone to a 2year old, if he can use it within 5 minutes, the product is a success. And all the extra good features, great. but keep it clean and easy to use. And ofcourse fast.
[13:55:28] <sebas> interestingly, last week one of the ubuntu devs said that he'd be using exactly one scope, while scopes bring the "hot thing" on ubuntu
[13:55:46] <ahoneybun> mm
[13:56:17] <slijkhuis> But hey, I'm not the expert ^^ just as I see it.
[13:56:27] <sebas> actually, I should check on ubuntu touch's latest status ... me charges his ubuntu phone and updates...
[13:56:29] <colomar> notmart: Help/feedback/teamwork from whom? Dirk Hohndel has also started to send patches upstream...
[13:56:47] <notmart> yep, working great with dirk
[13:56:49] <ahoneybun> sebas, on Tablets OTA10 (latest) is pretty nice
[13:56:54] <sebas> slijkhuis: acceptance seems to be way better with a "bread and butter" UI, not something fancy
[13:56:56] <bshah> one thing that would be lovely to see, is more base stack to choose from, currently we have Ubuntu touch stack experimented..
[13:56:58] <ahoneybun> little glitchy for me switching apps
[13:57:02] <sebas> ahoneybun: bq4 here
[13:57:11] <ahoneybun> oh the 4.5
[13:57:21] <ahoneybun> I HAD a N4 till it died
[13:57:24] <sebas> bshah: agree, I totally want my phone to run essentially Debian :D
[13:57:30] <notmart> would like more involvment from the internal team too tough
[13:57:59] <sebas> notmart: which internal team? Ubuntu's?
[13:58:17] <notmart> uh?
[13:58:20] <notmart> i mean plasma, us
[13:58:34] <bshah> yep :p
[13:58:41] <sebas> ah, yes ... but I think we've been a bit too quiet on mobile topics ... so that's partly on us
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[13:59:31] <bshah> one thing about ubuntu touch is their covergence, in theory we also have covergence
[13:59:45] <bshah> but I am not sure where are we lacking on there?
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[13:59:49] <colomar> bshah: Yes, and we will soon have in practice as well
[13:59:55] <colomar> On the app side, at least
[14:00:09] <sebas> bshah: our libhybris stack doesn't do multiscreen
[14:00:19] <ahoneybun> is this channel logged sebas ?
[14:00:33] <sebas> ahoneybun: not publicly, but I've logs on my machine :P
[14:00:34] <bshah> ahoneybun: no
[14:00:55] <bshah> sebas: really, thats something new?
[14:01:08] <ahoneybun> oh ok I was wondering about making one for offline people, but you got that covered
[14:01:13] <sebas> no, I just picked it from mgraesslin :D
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[14:01:15] <colomar> We've just started working on Kirigami for desktop design, and discover, kube and peruse are already targeted for convergence
[14:01:33] <sebas> ahoneybun: log can be attached when we send notes to the list
[14:01:52] <notmart> yeah, i'm still not 100% sure how real convergence for kirigami will be possible
[14:02:09] <mgraesslin> bshah: we probably would need something (kwind?) to tell the world that it should switch to desktop ui
[14:02:09] <sebas> I'd be interested in doing some "convergency" things for my laptop as well, it has tent mode, which does nothing in Plasma right now
[14:02:21] <sebas> would be nice to at least rotate and start a virtual keyboard
[14:02:27] <mgraesslin> what's a "tent mode"
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[14:02:34] <notmart> frm the technical/qml standpoint, i can't think about ways it "really" works
[14:02:34] <bshah>  /\
[14:02:36] <apol> +1 to sebas's tent
[14:02:38] <mgraesslin> sebas: you know where the code for rotate lives ;-)
[14:02:54] <kbroulik> sebas: did you actually figure out how to tell that it's not in a differnt formfactor?
[14:03:03] <kbroulik> I've heard the krita guy complain a lot about how terrible that is on Linux
[14:03:04] <kbroulik> driver-wise
[14:03:09] <notmart> will be for apps that look more minimal, toy-ish(and that's not a bad thing to look toy-ish) applications anyways
[14:03:10] <sebas> mgraesslin: http://www.lenovo.com/images/subseries/lenovo-laptop-thinkpad-yoga-modes.png
[14:03:10] <kbroulik> *now in a
[14:03:18] <mgraesslin> ah
[14:03:31] <sebas> kbroulik: what do you mean?
[14:03:34] <mgraesslin> so yeah, needs rotation in kwin's drm platform plugin
[14:03:41] <sebas> ow ... nope, haven't experimented with it at all
[14:03:50] <mgraesslin> and we need a way to integrate maliit on the desktop
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[14:03:54] <notmart> sebas: is the transforming thing supported on linux for your?
[14:03:56] <sebas> mgraesslin: or an xrandr call :P
[14:04:02] <jensreu> There are some really wild ideas spinning right now concerning convergance targets and design sebas and I think that the work starting on kirigami for desktop is ... well its gonna be amazing
[14:04:04] <notmart> (mine really doesn't have drivers for that)
[14:04:07] <mgraesslin> sebas: pfff, we are only thinking in a Wayland world
[14:04:18] <colomar> notmart: What does Ubuntu have technically that we don't?
[14:04:20] <mgraesslin> or: there is no xrandr </jedihandmove>
[14:04:24] <sebas> notmart: don't know, assuming you mean if I get some sort of signal when it's "tented"
[14:04:27] <colomar> If they can do convergence technically, why can't we?
[14:04:31] <notmart> colomar: nothing, in one word: marketing
[14:04:47] <mgraesslin> colomar: because we don't go the last mile to finish it
[14:04:52] <bshah> ^
[14:04:54] <sebas> what mgraesslin says
[14:04:57] <notmart> ie their phone applications on desktop are very toyish as well, just that they say they are perfect
[14:05:02] <sebas> stack supports it, it's just not used
[14:05:04] -*- ahoneybun checks out for work
[14:05:23] <bshah> I would love to know what is that last mile and put some effort in getting it really working
[14:05:25] <sebas> ahoneybun: cheers
[14:05:31] <colomar> notmart: I've seen that, but why would it not be possible to do more professional apps with Kirigami?
[14:05:31] <bshah> ahoneybun: thanks for joining
[14:05:36] <sebas> bshah: let's add a task \o/
[14:05:42] -*- sebas does that
[14:05:57] <bshah> I've no powers to create task :o
[14:06:01] <mgraesslin> let's put out an internal aim: sebas's tent has to work at Akademy
[14:06:02] <ahoneybun> here is the pad so far sebas : https://notes.kde.org/p/3SgVcdHiAs
[14:06:08] <notmart> colomar: don't know, i'm coming to think more and more that no, a completely different implementation of the ui is neeeded
[14:06:13] <sebas> mgraesslin: that sounds so freaking wrong ...
[14:06:16] <notmart> coming from years of thinking the other way around
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[14:06:52] <kbroulik> sebas: mgraesslin one thing windows does when you hook it up to a TV is scale to 150%, so perhaps in tent mode we could also make everything bigger, or so
[14:07:01] <colomar> notmart: That was always our plan (from the design side). But I've been told that QtQuick app can load a different QML file on context change. Have I been lied to?
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[14:07:34] <sebas> any takers for the convergence task?
[14:07:37] <notmart> colomar: some of it is possible
[14:07:40] <jensreu> kbroulik: the risk there is that we end up with a UI that just scales up which, in truth, is not very good (and the issue the Unity guys are running into)
[14:07:42] <sebas> would of course benefit the desktop as well
[14:07:49] <bshah> sebas: mgraesslin: personally I would love to see covergence as well from pmc perspective too
[14:07:54] <sebas> colomar: you as designer?
[14:07:54] <mgraesslin> sebas: we need to split the task down into multiple items
[14:07:56] <colomar> That was the convergence vision I've kept preaching ever since Plasma Active, and people liked it (and found it much better than Ubuntu's)
[14:07:58] <notmart> convergence of what? the shell? kirigami?
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[14:08:07] <sebas> mgraesslin: description right now:
[14:08:07] <bshah> notmart: shell
[14:08:08] <jensreu> sebas: ping there is some talk there already going
[14:08:10] <sebas> Our stack supports switching form factors, we just don't use it yet. This task is to:
[14:08:10] <sebas> - research what we want to do exactly
[14:08:10] <sebas> - identify missing implementation points
[14:08:10] <sebas> - fix these things
[14:08:10] <sebas> Task may be split into subtasks after research period.\
[14:08:13] <notmart> i'm thinking about this convergence thing when working on kirigami night and day
[14:08:19] <colomar> sebas: Well, it already _is_ my task as a designer. I guess jensreu is in, too. And we have Alex L, of course
[14:08:27] <notmart> just because i didn'0t came to a solution yet doesn't mean it doesn't exist
[14:08:34] <jensreu> what colomar said we are all in on this
[14:08:47] <sebas> cool
[14:08:56] <mgraesslin> oh did you guys see my screenshot of QtVirtualKeyboard in the lock screen?
[14:09:07] <mgraesslin> that's one of the things which would be useful for these convertables
[14:09:08] -*- apol no
[14:09:09] <colomar> The whole VDG has been all excited about convergence ever since it existed ;)
[14:09:27] <notmart> colomar: from me, from a technical standpoint, the restriction that i would put on the design is to change as least as possible in the ui from the phone ui where makes sense, because anything that is radically different, i think it spikes complexity esponentially
[14:09:28] <jensreu> The main issue here for us I think is that there is a really easy path for convergance which is upscaling a phone UI and we are all in clear agreement that that is not the way to go
[14:09:38] <sebas> okay, let's get on with the meeting
[14:09:52] <sebas> do we have any more  plans that we'd like to work on?
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[14:10:13] <notmart> so, to make it short yep, i want to try to make it happen, but pleease keep it as simple as possible
[14:10:17] <jensreu> notmart: lets chat after meeting
[14:10:19] <sebas> I have owncloud client on my list, which progresses rather slowly (upstream is really slow to review patches)
[14:10:54] <notmart> and again, i would have somebody else from the people that know qml thinking about it as well
[14:10:55] <bshah> one another thing is Plasma mobile emulator, and I will be mentoring GSoC student to work on it
[14:11:12] <bshah> she is unfortunately not available on IRC currently
[14:11:15] <colomar> sebas: Maybe it would help if we made it clear to them that we have bigger plans for integration with ownCloud? So they might see us as a valid partner again after I guess a lot of ground has been burned in the past?
[14:11:20] <mgraesslin> meh, cannot produce the lockscreen again, dbus is too broken on my system
[14:11:39] <sebas> colomar: we've been talking about it, plans are clear
[14:11:43] <sebas> just reviews are too slow
[14:12:13] <sebas> I think we're past the ground burnt phase for some time already, which is good
[14:12:31] <bshah> one more point, devices..
[14:12:37] <colomar> Good to hear, sebas! :)
[14:12:49] <bshah> We currently have working system on Nexus 5 and One plus one.
[14:12:52] <sebas> on the plus side: my last set of patches has gotten a review yesterday, so it's in my lap now again
[14:12:53] <mgraesslin> http://paste.opensuse.org/60624303
[14:13:06] <-- ahjolinna_ (~ahjolinna at mobile-access-5d6a38-212.dhcp.inet.fi) has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[14:13:22] <jensreu> mgraesslin: nice! :D
[14:13:26] <bshah> any help will be welcome from community to get Plasma mobile working on their devices
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[14:13:50] -*- mgraesslin sees the "nice!" as a signal I should turn that into a proper patch
[14:13:56] <sebas> +1
[14:14:11] <jensreu> +1
[14:14:16] <sebas> also needed for working tent mode
[14:14:18] <sebas> :P
[14:14:19] <bshah> we also have E5 (ubntu touch device) in  "boots and draws stuff" state
[14:14:33] <sebas> I always think of "boner under blanket" when mentioning tent mode :(
[14:14:52] <bshah> anyway, any other work items to add?
[14:14:59] <jensreu> mgraesslin: there was someone working on a spellchecker thing that also did predictive text? Might be the one awesome thing we could add too?
[14:15:00] <mgraesslin> sebas is still 14
[14:15:03] <sebas> mgraesslin: you're adding a task to the board?
[14:15:06] <sebas> mgraesslin: at most
[14:15:15] <colomar> sebas: Especially with "sebas's tent has to work at Akademy" :P
[14:15:35] <mgraesslin> sebas: done
[14:15:41] <bshah> jensreu: kbroulik got that predictive keyboard plugin working with our stack sometime ago
[14:15:53] <sebas> won't take long and people refer to my genital as the official Plasma Penis, and I'm not sure that this is how I want to enter history books
[14:15:54] <mgraesslin> jensreu: I don't see where that fits in
[14:16:01] <jensreu> right... see I knew I saw it somewhere...
[14:16:26] <bshah> I *think* we are done with meeting.. ;)
[14:16:30] <jensreu> Well not for this case specifically (passwords and predictive text sounds scary) but for the "desktop" (as in tablet mode)
[14:16:34] <mgraesslin> "detect input language from password" - sounds great to me
[14:16:36] <sebas> nothing else from my side
[14:16:45] <jensreu> mgraesslin: :D yeah
[14:16:53] <sebas> mgraesslin: "your native language is wingdings!"
[14:16:55] -*- mgraesslin continues being bshah's test flashing device
[14:17:02] <bshah> :-D
[14:17:18] <bshah> okay cool, thanks everyone for attending..