[Kmymoney] Problems created by lack of knowledge...

[Zed]

Hello Jack

Thank you for your very prompt reply.

Please forgive my tardiness in replying but we've just finished building our
new accommodation and I've been busy assembling a kit-set kitchen and
installing it.  It took far, far longer than I anticipated and I realise
that I'm now getting old!

Jack <ostroffjh at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> On 2013.02.08 17:38, Zed wrote:
> > Using KMoney v3.98.1
> This is a very old version.  As soon as you figure out your problem, you
> should upgrade.  4.6.3 is the latest version, although instructions on
> upgrading would depend on your platform/distribution.

I realise that the version of KMM I am using is old but it is the latest
.deb file and is in my repositories.

I am using SolusOS, based on Debian Stable.

I did download KMM v2.4.6 as a tar.bz2 file but haven't attempted to install
it, yet.


> > I am confused as I think my accounting skill are sadly lacking!
> 
> > I have a Property account with four Asset Accounts - Cheque, Cash,
> > Partner 1, Partner 2.

> I'm not sure what a Property account is, although I don't think it
> matters.  If it is just a way for you to keep these four accounts
> together, that is fine.

Yes, you are correct, the account is property.kmy

> > Payments are normally made from the Cheque account and receipts are
> > banked to that account.
> So far, so good.
> 
> > However, at times, the Cheque account has insufficient funds to meet a
> > payment.  In this case, one of the partners meets the expense and is
> > subsequently reimbursed.
> This makes sense to me.
> 
> > This is what I have been doing and it is obviously the wrong way to do
> > it.
> We won't really know if it's wrong until we figure out where your problem
> is, as it seems a reasonable approach to me.
> 
> > When the cheque account has sufficient funds.  Pay expenses from that
> > account.
> > 
> > When there are insufficient funds in the cheque account.
> > 
> > Pay direct from the partner's account by selecting that account, e.g.
> > Partner 1 and "Pay to" the supplier and allocate to the correct expenses
> > account.  The expense account shows a debit and the Partner's account a
> > credit. At this pint I can see nothing amiss.
> If by "expense" account, you mean the category, that's OK.  I also assume
> here the supplier account (Payee) should also show the debig.
> 
> > When reimbursed, I have been selecting the Cheque account and paying the
> > Partner account the reimbursement, expecting a credit to appear on the
> > cheque account and a debit on the Partner's account but this is not
> > happening. I have tried various options of Withdrawals, Deposits and
> > Transfers but seem to be digging myself into a deeper hole!

> First, I assume you mean that the Cheque account has had a sufficient
> deposit to cover the amount of the purchase.  Since you now need to
> transfer the funds from the Cheque account to the Partner account, a
> Transfer is the appropriate type of transaction.  A regular deposit or
> withdrawal would not work, since they transfer between the account and the
> payee.  However, what do you see when you make a transfer from the Cheque
> account to the Partner account?  It does seem something is going wrong
> here, but we need more information before we just blame it on your
> approach.

If I open the Cheque account and choose Transfer I have the option:

Pay to and given a choice from the list of Payees.  Below that is
Transfer to, with the options of the Asset Accounts (Partner1, Partner2, and
Cash

or From and given the choice of any of the Payees. Below that is

Transfer from, with the choices of all the Asset and Income accounts, plus
all the Category accounts.

Whatever I do, it seems that the payment in the Partner account is recorded
as a Payment.
 
> > It is now apparent to me that I have go the basics wrong and need to
> > rethink what is the correct way but I have got myself in a position
> > where I can no longer think logically about what I should or shouldn't
> > do.
> > 
> > Is anyone able to explain what I should do in the situation outlined.
> > If it means starting over again, I'll do so to get myself out of this
> > impenetrable fog.

> No suggestions until we figure out what is actually happening.  If it's
> easy to fix, no point in starting over.
> 
> 
> Just to show what I would expect:
> 
> Starting balances:
>   Cheque: 100,  Partner: 500
> 
> You need to pay "Store" 200, so you create a payment from Cheque to Store
> for 200, and the balances should be:
>   Cheque: 100,  Partner: 300
> 
> You get income of 300 which you deposit to Cheque, giving
>   Cheque: 400,  Partner 300
> 
> Now you transfer 200 from Cheque to Partner.  You do NOT need to specify a
> Payee or a Category, as these were set in the payment transaction above.
>   Cheque: 200,  Partner: 500
> What do you actually see at this point?

Unfortunately I deleted the "knitpick" to your posting and cannot remember
the details.  However, following your example as best as I am able. when I
come to the Transfer part I get the options I outline above and, for the
life of me, I cannot get my head around where I am going astray.

There is another aspect I realised a few minutes ago.  Each partner pays to
the Property account, by internet transfer, monies to meet monthly expenses.
 These, of course, show as deposits on the Property Bank Account and I enter
them as income from the partner in the Cheque account.  But these are not
payments for which the partner would expect to be refunded, unlike the
payments made by a partner which are not to meet regular expenses.  How can
I best treat these payments.

Some general questions.

(1) Am I correct in showing the Parners' accounts as Assets.

(2) I have the partners also entered as payors/payees.  Is this correct?

(3) Would it be better to show any money from a partner, which is expected
to be refunded, as a non interest loan?  And keep the partner's asset
accounts merely for routine monthly payments to meet expenses.

Again, thank you for your very prompt reply.  If you would prefer to take
this to email, the email address in the From: filed is valid.

David Love


-- 
David
Bachelor: One who is footloose & fiance free!