8K Support?

farid abdelnour snd.noise at gmail.com
Wed Jul 29 12:38:26 BST 2020

Em qua., 29 de jul. de 2020 às 07:53, Tobiasz Karoń <unfa00 at gmail.com>

> I simply exported my pre-composited footage from Olive and the first 3/4
> of the video I've managed to edit and completed the project in Kdenlive.
> I had some bad audio glitches from Kdenlive though, so I wasn't happy :(

The audio artifacts that have haunted us for so many years have finally
been fixed and will be in the next release of MLT (6.22). Btw, do use the
Kdenlive AppImage since it uses MLT from master and fixes this...

> I think Olive is going to implement Open Timeline IO too, but I don't know
> what the status of that is.
> On Tue, Jul 28, 2020, 15:44 <amindfv at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Thanks, there's a lot of good info here! You mention switching from Olive
>> to Kdenlive to finish an edit. Does Olive have a standardized file format?
>> Was the switching process painful?
>> Also, does Olive have a CLI?
>> Tom
>> El 27 jul 2020, a las 21:19, Tobiasz Karoń <unfa00 at gmail.com> escribió:
>> I would personally not bet on MLT improving here. It's a very old
>> framework with a legacy that's holding it back, and it doesn't seem to get
>> much development done. I think it'd be best if video editors simply stopped
>> considering it a good option. We have way too many "front-ends" to MLT all
>> being held back by it's limited design.
>> OpenShot tried to go beyond MLT, but... that apparently didn't go too
>> well.
>> I'm glad Kdenlive has started work to make it possible to implement a
>> different back-end (maybe some cooperation with the Olive team could
>> occur?) - and also implementing Open Timeline IO. I hope we can create some
>> synergy between software using such open data exchange standards.
>> Especially since they are used in the industry - which could help "serious"
>> people consider using libre software.
>> There's a long way to go before that's gonna be possible, but I think
>> we're on a good track.
>> I've been using Olive Video Editor for the past year or so (also limited
>> to 8-bit color, at least for output - the processing is done 100% using
>> GLSL so it's in a good position to develop further from that though - I
>> even made my own effects for it). There's a rewrite going on that
>> incorporated Open Color IO for flexible color management, also a node
>> editor for fine grained control of all the processing being done (in the
>> future this should allow for insanely powerful compositing but also reusing
>> and sharing your own effects etc.), There's also a timeline proxy being
>> implemented that stores frames in EXR files (an SSD for a scratch drive
>> would be very recommended - I should test that more myself). I believe it's
>> also ingesting input media (converting frames to EXR) not sure if that's
>> mandatory though from my testing.
>> That'll possibly allow for very responsive scrubbing. Also the rendering
>> pipeline can use reduced resolution to speed up the compositing - I'm happy
>> Kdenlive implemented that recently (in Kdenlive it's possibly more useful
>> right now).
>> So far the new Olive version is very unstable and can't be used to do any
>> work really, but they're doing great progress with it and release updated
>> builds very often (evey week or more frequently - so called Continuous
>> Build).
>> It's taking a lot of time, but it seems they can do without duct tape and
>> build an open-source NLE that'll finally have a chance to not only have a
>> nice UI and workflow, but also have all the basic and advanced features
>> you'd want and let you use good cameras or deep-color CGI renders, composit
>> and process that and get top-quality results with them. While also
>> utilizing modern computer hardware in 100%.
>> Now - Olive is not perfect and I had some serious issues with it, where I
>> had to fallback to Kdenlive to finish editing a video as it's would crash
>> every few seconds in projects longer than 20 minutes. I've finally found a
>> build that doesn't have this bug and can work on it, but that was bad. The
>> main developer seems to have an idea what the issue is though, I've worked
>> with him to solve this.
>> Olive's 0.1 version is the current "stable alpha" that I use - it's very
>> limited in effects compared to Kdenlive (they are more reliable and not
>> redundant though), but it's responsive and I like the editing tools a lot.
>> When I edit my videos I always need at least 2 audio tracks in sync, and
>> min. 2 composited images with chroma keying.
>> In Blender VSE I had to train myself to cut in a very specific way to
>> keep everything in sync (manually making sure I keep the sync between
>> strips) because it had no way to link strips together, only group them into
>> meta-strips (Olive has that option too - Nesting).
>> In Kdenlive I always had issues importing my multiple audio tracks and
>> even though linking works, the editing tools never worked for me as well as
>> they do in Olive.
>> Also - in any libre NLE I tried (all were heavily CPU-bound and
>> single-threaded) compositing 2 or more 1080p layers dropped preview
>> framerate to 15-20 FPS, and if you add a blur effect - it goes below 10.
>> Olive can do this in realtime thanks to OpenGL if the files are not too
>> high quality (I've recently started encoding H.264 proxy files) - seems
>> that decoding 15Mbps H.264 is a bottleneck in Olive, and it's default
>> Protest proxy files take ages to encode and are insanely big.
>> I'm sorry - I think I went completely off-topic...
>> It's very late, I should go to sleep :D
>> Good night!
>> - unfa
>> On Tue, Jul 28, 2020, 01:29 <amindfv at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Agh this sucks! I did read this in the mlt docs but at the time it
>>> wasn't limiting what I was doing... I will ask on the MLT list if there's
>>> any work being done on this.
>>> El 27 jul 2020, a las 14:44, Tobiasz Karoń <unfa00 at gmail.com> escribió:
>>> MLT (and hence all software that depends on it) is hard-coded for 8-bit
>>> color. It was created for TV broadcasting, not video editing really.
>>> I am not sure about Blender VSE nowadays - maybe that one allows working
>>> with deep color?
>>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 13:14 <amindfv at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Does Kdenlive/MLT not support 10-bit color?
>>>> El 25 jul 2020, a las 19:35, Tobiasz Karoń <unfa00 at gmail.com> escribió:
>>>> Out of curiosity: what would you need 8K for?
>>>> And also - wouldn't you need 10-bit color too?
>>>> - unfa
>>>> sob., 25 lip 2020 o 19:02 Almond Joy <almondjoyix at gmail.com>
>>>> napisał(a):
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> Is your video editing software 8K compatible?
>>>>> Thank You
>>>> --
>>>> - Tobiasz 'unfa' Karoń
>>>> www.youtube.com/unfa000

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