kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 16
Loren Dias
lorendias at gmail.com
Thu Jan 26 04:49:35 CET 2006
"If a good and complete "KDE Control Center" exists, each distribution
should change only the "Install Software" module inside the "KDE Control
Center""
I agree that package management should be taken care of by the control
center and plugged into by the distributions backends like apt-get or uRpmi
(i think it's called)
"Everything else is fine except for two things.
1. Having all programs within a separate menu instead of within the main
menu is very *Windows* like and could raise complaints. Is there a different
(aka new) and usable way we could do this?
2. Having *Session split off into a separate menu is not a good idea. The
Logout/Restart/Shutdown buttons need to be easy to find and easy to click
(without the chance of missing them and having to start all over again from
the main menu!). Having them within another menu can also be obscure and
hard to find."
1) I have submenus on my windows machine in 'program files' such as
"Development", "Games", "Internet", "Multimedia", "Office", "Recording", and
"System". Do I do this because I love linux so much? Or do I do it because
it's well thought out?
I feel that the applications are fine together, but when stacked with the
logon/logoff/run & switch users stuff it really gets complex looking and
takes away from the sleek feeling
Personally I'm in love with this feel
http://vladoboss.softver.org.mk/mg2/index.php?id=40
It reminds me of the simplicity and clean feel of Gnome, yet it incorperates
usabilitiy of computers in a new form. What I think would be amazing is if
KDE incorperated Kopete into the GUI so you can always be on your IM
application, it would be even more interesting if somehow through Kopete
built into the GUI that Remote Assistance and co-working on the same file at
the same time with multipule users could provide some amazing advantages,
especially with microphones, and even now Webcams.
It would also be wonderful to incorperate desktop applets so that these
contacts could be transparently shown on the desktop as well as have things
like a music player, a mail reporter (aka: Gmail notifier for Firefox). This
is personally what turned me on about Enlightenment so much, the fact that
you could add whatever features you wanted and discard the rest (just the
same as extensions in firefox). Many users don't have as much system
resources at hand as others, and having extensions or moduels, or addons, or
whatever you want to call it would totally rule.
So what would I like to see done?
1) Control Center redesigned with heavy refference to PC-BSD Control Center
example: http://vladoboss.softver.org.mk/mg2/index.php?id=39
2) Incorperate all WiFi, configuration, and many of the items from Utilities
into the Control Center to give "central access"
3) Clean up the menu's getting rid of un-necessacary bloat (90% of the
items)
4) Minimalize the Desktop and instead place Extensions making the desktop
form to the user rather than the user form to the desktop
5) Incorperate Software Installation and GUI to apt/urpmi built into the
control panel
Cool things
6) Incorperate Kopete or the different Messenger services into the Menus
providing an "always on" service
7) pop3 email notifier built into the system, either that or just use
Kontact
I challenge every KDE Developer to re-invent the way we use computers,
because only Open Source has the opertunity to change the way we use
computers and enhance the experience, Winows and Mac can't afford these
kinds of risks with their userbase. Thanks for listening to me,
.03
(PS: looks like I'm off to PC-BSD until I find something better, Kubuntu?)
- Loren
On 1/25/06, kde-quality-request at kde.org <kde-quality-request at kde.org> wrote:
>
> Send kde-quality mailing list submissions to
> kde-quality at kde.org
>
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>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (Loren Dias)
> 2. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (I?aki)
> 3. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (Jeremy)
> 4. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (I?aki)
> 5. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (Vlad Blanton)
> 6. Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15 (I?aki)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 07:20:44 -0800
> From: Loren Dias <lorendias at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: kde-quality at kde.org
> Message-ID:
> <1a3e66e00601250720h7ef3b26cva7faf69360fd8a33 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I've seen this image:
> http://vladoboss.softver.org
> >
> > .mk/mg2/index.php?id=
>
>
>
> I think the idea of a New Control Center is an absolute must!
>
> I'm not even kidding either, one of the Negatives I've always had against
> KDE was the hard to navigate and scattered controls. No I'm not par say
> anything more than a simple user, but what better reason to have me around
> than to give my oppinion?
>
> I've tested probably around 20 Distribution Flavors (not including
> versions), and some BSD's, so far the only one to even get close to making
> a
> usable control panel is Kubuntu
>
> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=556&slide=33
>
> Aside from this I feel the menus are Overbloated in so many distributions,
> It might be a good idea to have "Internet", "Office", "Multimedia"...etc
> under a little menu called "Applications"
>
> PC-BSD Has a wonderful example I feel KDE could learn from
> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=564&slide=9
> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=564&slide=7
>
> Everyone constantly argues that "Linux is about choice", and that's right,
> but isn't there a point when you overdo that choice? Overdo it to the
> point
> where you take something so beautiful with potential like KDE and just
> hold
> it down with the 10 text editors that come with it, and three different
> office suits. When is enough enough? And how long will the uses have to
> suffer for having choice rather than having something that works
> seemlessly,
> and lets you focus on your work rather than the computer (OS X Anyone?)
>
> Anyways, I feel that control panel screeshot was incredibly awsome and
> attractive. I would love to see it done, it's too bad that linux
> development
> is more scattered than centralized.
>
> One last thing, if you decide to critisize my message, please take the
> whole
> into consideration,
>
>
> - Loren
>
> (When will Mozilla take over KDE lol)
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 16:59:33 +0100
> From: I?aki <ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: kde-quality at kde.org
> Message-ID: <200601251659.33164.ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> El Mi?rcoles, 25 de Enero de 2006 16:20, Loren Dias escribi?:
> > Aside from this I feel the menus are Overbloated in so many
> distributions,
> > It might be a good idea to have "Internet", "Office", "Multimedia"...etc
> > under a little menu called "Applications"
> >
> > PC-BSD Has a wonderful example I feel KDE could learn from
> > http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=564&slide=9
> > http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=564&slide=7
>
> I don't like these photos. In Kmenu I see:
> * Computer - PC-BSD Settings
> * Control Center
> * Settings
> * System Menu
>
> Which is the difference between them? only after opening all the entries
> maybe
> possible to see the diference, but they are not intuitive for me.
>
> It could be better just with one entry: "Control Center". That's all.
>
> Why not a simple menu like the following?
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------
> * Recents apps
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * PC
> * Programs
> * Control Center
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * Find
> * Run Command
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * Session
> --------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> And those are the entries of each submenu:
>
> ------------------------------------------------
> * Recents apps
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * PC
> - My Home
> - Devices
> - Remote Sites
> * Programs
> - Internet
> - Multimedia
> - Office
> - ...
> * Control Center
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * Find
> * Run Command
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * Session
> - Switch User
> - Lock Session
> - Log Out...
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> Note: "Find" program should be something much better than Kfind, something
> that let the user look for anything in files, documents, mails, kopete
> conversations... I think there is something similar for KDE in developing.
>
>
> Of course, in "Programs" - "Internet" shouldn't be applpications like
> Kppp,
> KwifiManager or similar. All about networking configuration should be
> integrated in "Control Center" - "Networking".
>
>
> Just my opinion ;)
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:31:15 +0100
> From: Jeremy <jeremy.mandriva at free.fr>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: "Contributors support and coordination, to make KDE rock!"
> <kde-quality at kde.org>
> Message-ID: <43D7A7D3.3080800 at free.fr>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> I?aki wrote:
>
> >Why not a simple menu like the following?
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------
> > * Recents apps
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * PC
> > * Programs
> > * Control Center
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * Find
> > * Run Command
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * Session
> >--------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >And those are the entries of each submenu:
> >
> >------------------------------------------------
> > * Recents apps
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * PC
> > - My Home
> > - Devices
> > - Remote Sites
> > * Programs
> > - Internet
> > - Multimedia
> > - Office
> > - ...
> > * Control Center
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * Find
> > * Run Command
> >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > * Session
> > - Switch User
> > - Lock Session
> > - Log Out...
> >--------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> This menu is very close to the proposition of the current Mandriva
> distribution. The only difference I see is that Mandriva proposes the
> KDE Control Center and the Mandriva Control Center.
> This to say that it is a good project for KDE to provide a powerful
> framework to create Control Center for system setting.
> But there is may be no need to give strict Control Center because all
> the distribution have to put inside how to modify their own specificities.
>
> J?r?my
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:57:31 +0100
> From: I?aki <ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: kde-quality at kde.org
> Message-ID: <200601251757.31339.ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> El Mi?rcoles, 25 de Enero de 2006 17:31, Jeremy escribi?:
> > I?aki wrote:
> > >Why not a simple menu like the following?
> > >
> > >
> > >------------------------------------------------
> > > * Recents apps
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * PC
> > > * Programs
> > > * Control Center
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * Find
> > > * Run Command
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * Session
> > >--------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >And those are the entries of each submenu:
> > >
> > >------------------------------------------------
> > > * Recents apps
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * PC
> > > - My Home
> > > - Devices
> > > - Remote Sites
> > > * Programs
> > > - Internet
> > > - Multimedia
> > > - Office
> > > - ...
> > > * Control Center
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * Find
> > > * Run Command
> > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > * Session
> > > - Switch User
> > > - Lock Session
> > > - Log Out...
> > >--------------------------------------------------
> >
> > This menu is very close to the proposition of the current Mandriva
> > distribution. The only difference I see is that Mandriva proposes the
> > KDE Control Center and the Mandriva Control Center.
> > This to say that it is a good project for KDE to provide a powerful
> > framework to create Control Center for system setting.
> > But there is may be no need to give strict Control Center because all
> > the distribution have to put inside how to modify their own
> specificities.
>
> This should be the proposal of KDE in the future: avoid the need of the
> distributions of adding their own "Control Center". I don't know Mandriva,
> but if they add a "Mandriva Control Center" maybe because the "KDE Control
> Center" is not enough, that is true today.
>
> If a good and complete "KDE Control Center" exists, each distribution
> should
> change only the "Install Software" module inside the "KDE Control
> Center" (for Debian, Mandriva...) and modify some code because the
> different
> locations of each distro (/etc directories and files, for example).
>
>
>
> --
> y hasta aqu? puedo leer...
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 15:53:33 -0500
> From: Vlad Blanton <vblanton at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: "Contributors support and coordination, \ to make KDE rock!"
> <kde-quality at kde.org>
> Message-ID: <200601251553.33932.vblanton at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hello all, I'm new to the list :) Should have added myself to the list a
> long
> time ago...
>
> I like the *Recent apps part of the proposed layout. That way we won't
> have to
> search for the location of a new program for a few minutes each time
> something is installed. It might be nice to have something indicate where
> it
> is located within the *Programs menu like...
>
> *Recent apps
> - Quanta Plus! (Web Development Environment) (Development)
> - Firefox (Web Browser) (Internet)
> - K3b (CD/DVD Burning) (Multimedia)
> - Battle For Wesnoth (Strategy Game) (Games)
> - KPresenter (Slide Presentations) (Office)
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * PC....
>
> Everything else is fine except for two things.
> 1. Having all programs within a separate menu instead of within the main
> menu
> is very *Windows* like and could raise complaints. Is there a different
> (aka
> new) and usable way we could do this?
> 2. Having *Session split off into a separate menu is not a good idea. The
> Logout/Restart/Shutdown buttons need to be easy to find and easy to click
> (without the chance of missing them and having to start all over again
> from
> the main menu!). Having them within another menu can also be obscure and
> hard to find.
>
> Hope my input helps a bit.
>
> Vladislav Blanton
>
> On Wednesday 25 January 2006 11:57 am, I?aki wrote:
> > El Mi?rcoles, 25 de Enero de 2006 17:31, Jeremy escribi?:
> > > I?aki wrote:
> > > >Why not a simple menu like the following?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >------------------------------------------------
> > > > * Recents apps
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * PC
> > > > * Programs
> > > > * Control Center
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * Find
> > > > * Run Command
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * Session
> > > >--------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >And those are the entries of each submenu:
> > > >
> > > >------------------------------------------------
> > > > * Recents apps
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * PC
> > > > - My Home
> > > > - Devices
> > > > - Remote Sites
> > > > * Programs
> > > > - Internet
> > > > - Multimedia
> > > > - Office
> > > > - ...
> > > > * Control Center
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * Find
> > > > * Run Command
> > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > * Session
> > > > - Switch User
> > > > - Lock Session
> > > > - Log Out...
> > > >--------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > This menu is very close to the proposition of the current Mandriva
> > > distribution. The only difference I see is that Mandriva proposes the
> > > KDE Control Center and the Mandriva Control Center.
> > > This to say that it is a good project for KDE to provide a powerful
> > > framework to create Control Center for system setting.
> > > But there is may be no need to give strict Control Center because all
> > > the distribution have to put inside how to modify their own
> > > specificities.
> >
> > This should be the proposal of KDE in the future: avoid the need of the
> > distributions of adding their own "Control Center". I don't know
> Mandriva,
> > but if they add a "Mandriva Control Center" maybe because the "KDE
> Control
> > Center" is not enough, that is true today.
> >
> > If a good and complete "KDE Control Center" exists, each distribution
> > should change only the "Install Software" module inside the "KDE Control
> > Center" (for Debian, Mandriva...) and modify some code because the
> > different locations of each distro (/etc directories and files, for
> > example).
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2006 22:29:20 +0100
> From: I?aki <ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Subject: Re: kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 15
> To: kde-quality at kde.org
> Message-ID: <200601252229.20850.ibc2 at euskalnet.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> El Mi?rcoles, 25 de Enero de 2006 21:53, Vlad Blanton escribi?:
> > Hello all, I'm new to the list :) Should have added myself to the list
> a
> > long time ago...
> >
> > I like the *Recent apps part of the proposed layout. That way we won't
> have
> > to search for the location of a new program for a few minutes each time
> > something is installed. It might be nice to have something indicate
> where
> > it is located within the *Programs menu like...
> >
> > *Recent apps
> > - Quanta Plus! (Web Development Environment) (Development)
> > - Firefox (Web Browser) (Internet)
> > - K3b (CD/DVD Burning) (Multimedia)
> > - Battle For Wesnoth (Strategy Game) (Games)
> > - KPresenter (Slide Presentations) (Office)
> > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> -
> > * PC....
>
> But "Recent apps" exists since KDE 3.3 or KDE 3.4. It's not something
> new. ;)
>
>
>
>
> > Everything else is fine except for two things.
> > 1. Having all programs within a separate menu instead of within the main
> > menu is very *Windows* like and could raise complaints. Is there a
> > different (aka new) and usable way we could do this?
>
> Maybe, I agree.
>
>
> > 2. Having *Session split off into a separate menu is not a good idea.
> The
> > Logout/Restart/Shutdown buttons need to be easy to find and easy to
> click
> > (without the chance of missing them and having to start all over again
> from
> > the main menu!). Having them within another menu can also be obscure
> and
> > hard to find.
>
> Yeeep, you are right.
>
>
> Anyway, I don't like the actual Kmenu, it's too large. Why not separate in
> two
> each one with an icon in the panel?
>
>
> First one: System:
> *******************
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> ?* PC
> ? ? ? - My Home
> ? ? ? - Devices
> ? ? ? - Remote Sites
> ?* Control Center
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> ?* Find
> ?* Run Command
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> * Switch User
> ?* Lock Session
> ?* Log Out...
> --------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> The second one: Apps:
> *************************
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> ?* Internet
> ? ? ? - Web navigator
> ? ? ? - Kopete
> ? ? ? - Ktorrent
> ? ? ? - ...
> * Multimedia
> - amaroK
> - KMplayer
> - ...
> * Office
> - Kwrite
> - Kpdf (please, move it from "Image" menu)
> ...
> --------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Is it OK? ;)
>
>
>
> > Hope my input helps a bit.
> >
> > Vladislav Blanton
> >
> > On Wednesday 25 January 2006 11:57 am, I?aki wrote:
> > > El Mi?rcoles, 25 de Enero de 2006 17:31, Jeremy escribi?:
> > > > I?aki wrote:
> > > > >Why not a simple menu like the following?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >------------------------------------------------
> > > > > * Recents apps
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * PC
> > > > > * Programs
> > > > > * Control Center
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * Find
> > > > > * Run Command
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * Session
> > > > >--------------------------------------------------
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >And those are the entries of each submenu:
> > > > >
> > > > >------------------------------------------------
> > > > > * Recents apps
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * PC
> > > > > - My Home
> > > > > - Devices
> > > > > - Remote Sites
> > > > > * Programs
> > > > > - Internet
> > > > > - Multimedia
> > > > > - Office
> > > > > - ...
> > > > > * Control Center
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * Find
> > > > > * Run Command
> > > > >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > > > > * Session
> > > > > - Switch User
> > > > > - Lock Session
> > > > > - Log Out...
> > > > >--------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > This menu is very close to the proposition of the current Mandriva
> > > > distribution. The only difference I see is that Mandriva proposes
> the
> > > > KDE Control Center and the Mandriva Control Center.
> > > > This to say that it is a good project for KDE to provide a
> powerful
> > > > framework to create Control Center for system setting.
> > > > But there is may be no need to give strict Control Center because
> all
> > > > the distribution have to put inside how to modify their own
> > > > specificities.
> > >
> > > This should be the proposal of KDE in the future: avoid the need of
> the
> > > distributions of adding their own "Control Center". I don't know
> > > Mandriva, but if they add a "Mandriva Control Center" maybe because
> the
> > > "KDE Control Center" is not enough, that is true today.
> > >
> > > If a good and complete "KDE Control Center" exists, each distribution
> > > should change only the "Install Software" module inside the "KDE
> Control
> > > Center" (for Debian, Mandriva...) and modify some code because the
> > > different locations of each distro (/etc directories and files, for
> > > example).
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > kde-quality mailing list
> > kde-quality at kde.org
> > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-quality
>
> --
> y hasta aqu? puedo leer...
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> kde-quality mailing list
> kde-quality at kde.org
> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-quality
>
>
> End of kde-quality Digest, Vol 24, Issue 16
> *******************************************
>
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