A look at GNOME 2.14, comparison to KDE

Thu Feb 23 01:21:01 CET 2006

everyone has a choice, if they don't like kde they don't have to use it they
have got options, however what I said was really my attitude to people's
comments which I would probably say if they commented on any on my stuff,
but this is different with other people. However i don't want to say much as
pretty much more will be said, so i better keep quiet.

On 22/02/06, Anders Storsveen <wakko at generation.no> wrote:
>
> lol, why do everyone think it's the features that is the problem? it's
> not the features, it's the way some of them are presented.
> try not to make a flamewar out of this please. saying, "if they don't
> like it they can move to gnome or what ever" is kinda not what this list
> is all about.
>
> Mr Bulldog wrote:
> > some people are two finicky about small things and if they don't like
> > it they can move to gnome or what ever for the time being. Some
> > features I don't like in Kde is the amount of options in it, but what
> > do I care, looking at the overall picture at least I can get something
> > done much easier than gnome or other desktop environments. Really we
> > should be praising all the kde developers, if you don't want all of
> > the great features try kde light. However this argument is just
> > rambling on now.
> >
> > On 21/02/06, *Aaron J. Seigo* <aseigo at kde.org <mailto:aseigo at kde.org>>
> > wrote:
> >
> >     On Tuesday 21 February 2006 12:06, Janne Ojaniemi wrote:
> >     > But couldn't the same functionality be achieved without those
> frames
> >
> >     of course. however, it is not as easy as some tend to think to fix
> >     due to the
> >     added complexity of the code. sometimes it's not even possible to
> >     get it
> >     right without rather large changes. and that was my point: it's
> >     not fast
> >     work, it's not easy work, it's not fun work and it's almost always
> >     thankless
> >     at the end. the rather flippant "change these 10 things to make it
> not
> >     crappy!" lists really get tiring after a while; esp after i've
> >     seen that list
> >     100 times already.
> >
> >     > that frame the content-area. Since the background of the
> >     content-area and
> >     > the background of the window are different color (by default at
> >     least), you
> >     > have the differentiation right there, without having to use grey
> >     lines.
> >
> >     ... and test with different colour schemes and widget styles.
> >
> >     > I think that all else being equal, an app that looks good is
> >     > inherintly more usable than an app that doesn't look good.
> >
> >     well, it may be more pleasant to use. not always the same thing as
> >     "more
> >     usable"; it can certainly help win over users though, and make
> >     using the
> >     software more enjoyable.
> >
> >     > of "usability" or "cleanliness". I maintain that we CAN have a
> >     featurefull
> >     > and useful apps that look smooth, clean and gorgerous. It can be
> >     done.
> >
> >     i agree. unfortunately the chances of it being accomplished fully
> are
> >     diminished by the number of people who talk but can't/won't/don't
> >     actually
> >     help write the fixes. this is the biggest conundrum.
> >
> >     > > see ... if you feel that kde is resistant to "let's fix the
> >     interfaces"
> >     > > i'd like to know what communicates that and then hopefully fix
> >     it. it may
> >     > > be a real, valid issue within the project, if may be a matter
> >     of public
> >     > > perception, it may be a problem in communication, it may be
> >     that we don't
> >     > > have a properly visible means to bring in these contributions.
> >     i could
> >     > > guess, but only you know this answer when it comes to you and
> your
> >     > > statement above.
> >     >
> >     > I'm afraid that it's nothing really tangible that I could point
> >     with my
> >     > finger and say "it's this thing here". It just seems to me that
> >     KDE is
> >     > somewhat conservative when it comes to design-changes.
> >
> >     mostly due to manpower. we generally spend a lot of effort
> >     bringing something
> >     functional to the table and that has traditionally left very few
> >     hours for
> >     working on the interfaces. more people working on that would help
> >     immensely.
> >
> >     > KDE and some KDE-apps have a tendency to feel like they were....
> >     > designed by a committee
> >
> >     this is a problem of success: as the project has grown larger, our
> >     control
> >     through maintainership hasn't tightened to help shape the growing
> >     tide of
> >     contributions.
> >
> >     > feature in there. Everyone is afraid to remove anything, because
> >     someone
> >     > put that particular feature there, and people are afraid that
> >     they might
> >     > feel hurt if "their" feature was removed.
> >
> >     at least for me, it has little to do with being afraid of hurting
> >     the author's
> >     feelings. my biggest problem is how many people bitch about every
> >     fucking
> >     change. i am personally fed up with that particular class of
> >     ingrates who
> >     employ "scream, cry and whine" reaction to changes, doubly so when
> >     they are
> >     users who contribute exactly 0 back and within a month or two are
> >     just fine
> >     with the change.
> >
> >     it wouldn't take so much bravery if people didn't bitch and moan
> >     over every
> >     attempted change. worst is when their pointless bitching is
> >     ignored, they
> >     turn around accuse us of "not listening to users". it wouldn't
> >     take so much
> >     bravery if more people were making changes and proving it could be
> >     done. it
> >     wouldn't take so much bravery if more people spent real coding
> >     hours on these
> >     issues with each other so it wasn't such a lone-wolf task.
> >
> >     ask the people who look after things like capitalization standards
> >     or any of
> >     the other similar issues. it's really pathetic. for every one
> >     person fixing
> >     things, we have 100 talking about fixing them and 1000 bitching
> >     about how
> >     they aren't fixed they way they want.
> >
> >     i still get emails and comments on my blog about icon zooming in
> >     the panel.
> >
> >     no wonder so many people stop trying to change things: there is a
> >     real
> >     cultural problem amongst the hard core userbase. we've been
> >     working hard to
> >     fix cultural issues within the project, it'd be nice to see a
> >     similar effort
> >     from the users closest to the project as well. there is a reason
> >     other
> >     projects have just stopped listening altogether and decided to
> >     make every
> >     decision and centrally made policy decision, users be damned.
> >
> >     --
> >     Aaron J. Seigo
> >     GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA  EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
> >
> >     Full time KDE developer sponsored by Trolltech
> >     (http://www.trolltech.com)
> >
> >
> >     _______________________________________________
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> >     kde-quality at kde.org <mailto:kde-quality at kde.org>
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> >
> >
> >
> >
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