KDE Jabber Library

[Dominique Devriese]

Martijn Klingens <klingens at kde.org> writes:

> On Sunday 04 August 2002 13:46, Dominique Devriese wrote:
> > > And use two different IM backends, duplicating code, spreading out
> > > functionality and what more???
> >
> > This is a bogus argument, there's no reason for Kopete's jabber plugin
> > to not use the jabber lib if it would become available.
> 
> It's not. If Psi is a sole transport library it would be, but then Psi as 
> library is incomplete. You need a GUI to add a contact to your contact list, 
> remove it, edit it and select it. You need backend code to store the contact 
> in the KDE address book and fetch it again.

I see what you mean...  How would the kopete lib solve this ?

> > The only arguments against the jabber lib that make sense to me
> > are:
> >
<snip>
> > 2 It would require different connections to be made to the server
> > every time a program wants to send a message.  Although jabber servers
> > can handle this very well, it does seem somewhat bad.  You are imho
> > right that a DCOP thing would be better here..
> 
> DCOP or another way of IPC. At least a daemon-like process (with or without 
> GUI in e.g. the system tray) looks like a requirement here.

And you're suggesting this daemon-like process would be kopete ?
> 
> > 3 Like you also said: necessity for a new IM account.  On the one
> > hand, this seems like a good thing to me, cause it could convince
> > people to try out jabber, but on the other hand, some people might be
> > bothered by this.
> 
> If you're forced to use something you're not "convinced" but rather
> "required to".

Of course.  I don't know how well you know the KGame framework, but it
also requires you to use a certain messageserver at the moment.  It is
made transparent however by having it start in the background without
the user seeing it..  Maybe the same could be done with a jabber
server ?  Maybe KGame could be ported to use jabber ?

<snip>
> 
> > Benefits are:
> > 1 jabber supports a user connecting multiple times, so a kgame
> > invitation could be sent so that it doesn't go to Kopete, but to the
> > kgame program in question...  The presences allow you to check if the
> > other user's kgame program is running before trying to send a message,
> > and send it via Kopete if that is not the case...
> 
> With the proper code in Kopete that could be handled there as
> well. I've been  
> thinking a little about that and there are a number of ways to solve
> it more  
> generic, so it also works over other backends than Jabber. It's not
> quite a  
> priority for me as long as the API is still under heavy development,
> but  
> after that it would be a nice next step.

Jabber has the advantage here that the functionality is already
there...

> 
> > 2 jabber is an open protocol, and the best that seems available.  It
> > would make sense to me for KDE to support it.
> 
> If Kopete is part of KDE then KDE supports it through Kopete. We
> support HTTP  
> through KIO instead of a libkhttp as well.

of course, but by supporting i meant preferring it above other im
systems... 

> > KDE's genericness is indeed its biggest advantage, but you should see
> > that it is only appropriate when communicating with the outside
> > world.  HTTP, FTP... protocols (KIOSlaves), and HTML, PDF, PS... file
> > formats (KParts) are standards that are independent of KDE, and that a
> > Desktop Environment should support.  However, there's no need for a DE
> > to be generic in its internals too.  E.g. there is only one Config
> > file format ( a XML backend was not included a while ago, iirc ), one
> > .desktop file format etc.  IMHO, the same applies to KGame
> > invitations, which are internal to KDE.
> 
> As long as there are no Gnome games that support KGame's wire
> protocol that's  
> a KDE internal thing, sure. But you're sending the invitation over
> IM, no? In  
> my dictionary 'IM' reads as outside world. 

As i see it, you're just using IM to do communication between
different KDE desktops.  There's nothing that a different desktop
could do with the invitation. Furthermore, I don't think it would be
so easy for gnome games to support games using the KGame stuff...

> We could also skip tcp/ip and send  
> out our own protocols. Sometimes it's better to stick with what's
> out there,

jabber _is_ "out there".
> and not just a single non-generic solution.

you mean something like DCOP, KParts etc. ?
cheers
domi

-- 
Am I elected yet?