Non-C++ Apps in KDE Main Modules (Was: Guidance in KDE Admin)

Aaron J. Seigo aseigo at
Sun Mar 30 20:59:07 CEST 2008

On Sunday 30 March 2008, Mauricio Piacentini wrote:
> release-team-request at wrote:
> > decided, but really ... it's already been decided, unless someone can
> > bring up a really compelling reason to overturn it. That hasn't happened
> > at this point.
> So, it was already decided. Why are we wasting time with this? I feel

out of politeness and respect for the community? it's pretty crappy to just 
say to someone "hey, shut up, it's already been decided and you have no say 
in it!" it's nicer to take into considerations issues that get raised, 
especially in case there are valid ones, which is why i added "unless someone 
can bring up a really compelling reason". 

> stupid discussing something if a decision was already made. Is this
> decision published/available somewhere as a guideline or policy? If it

i don't think we codified it anywhere Official(tm). it was shared publicly 
after the Malaga meetings, however.

> is, then why this was not brought out on the recent kcd discussion, or
> to the ongoing discussion on this list? This would be simpler, and we
> could be done with it, without wasting energy.

i agree that there is wasted energy here, largely due to people not doing 
their homework before weighing in on the matter =/ but open systems are not 
efficient, they are effective.

> I thought this discussion spearheaded by Andras was a valid and
> important one and input from the community was needed, but apparently
> this is not what you are saying here. Can you confirm this?

just because python/ruby apps have already been given the "ok" does not make 
this discussion, in particular about this exact application, irrelevant. if 
nothing else, it helps bring everyone to consensus.

> In retrospect, I thought I made a clear and valid suggestion regarding
> experimentation with Python and other languages in plasmoids/games/edu
> to verify what this really brings to our community before requiring it
> in a minimal KDE install, but this was ignored in your email, Aaron.
> Maybe that is because (as you say) the decision was already made, is it?

that question is getting a bit close to conspiracy theory for my taste. i 
actually missed this suggestion of yours. let me address it here then:

we've already experimented with such bindings for years now: amarok's ruby 
scripting has been an unqualified success; guidance has been used extensively 
in distros with no python-related downsides; applications such as luma have 
shown you can do some fairly complex and highly apps with these bindings as 

if we look outside of the kde project, it becomes even more apparent. there 
are many highly successful non-C/C++ gtk+ apps, firefox's scripted extensions 
have been hugely, immensely successful for them.

this really isn't an area where experimentation is needed: evidence is already 
all around us. as a project, we have a rather bizarre fixation against 
python/ruby apps that is very similar to the bizarre fixation c devs have 
again c++ apps.

it's really about time we stopped wasting time and actually started taking 
advantage of the demonstrable and demonstrated benefits of these languages.

Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA  EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43

KDE core developer sponsored by Trolltech
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