Common purpose for the Plasma team, and VDG

[Sebastian Kügler]

Hi,

On Monday, November 09, 2015 01:10:41 AM Valorie Zimmerman wrote:
> Hello folks, this afternoon my time, a discussion started in #plasma
> with some rather upset designers, who said that they felt they are
> treated by the Plasma devels as children.
> 
> I waded into that discussion, and am reluctant to write to the list
> about it, but I think there are some issues here that we all should
> think about. So I guess it is worth the risk.
> 
> First, are all the designers on this list? If not, it's difficult to
> have a dialog. Please make sure that at least andreas_k and uriherrera
> (irc nicks) become part of this conversation. After all, they are
> Plasma devels.

That would be good, it fixes on side of one of the underlying issues. (My 3rd 
point about using different communication channels).

> I've read https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/125568/ and
> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=355058, both of which seem
> directly relevant.
> 
> I see both sides of the this conversation feeling distressed and
> unheard, and perhaps disrespected. We've got to fix this.

We talked about this topic first thing during our weekly hangout today, here's 
the gist of that:

* The discussion and feedback around the new theme went a bit unfortunate, 
there was absolutely no intention to make anyone angry, dismiss personal 
efforts or anything like that. In those cases where it still happened, sincere 
apologies, and the hope that it doesn't leave any hard feeling.

* Part of this is normal friction in high-profile work. The Plasma theme is 
very visible, and many people have opinions. There is a lot of work going on, 
and the high rate of change (which in itself is really not bad!) means that 
these frictions can get worse with larger bodies of work, and larger reworks. 
Incremental changes instead of bigger, all-or-nothing changes tend to help 
here, as they make it easier to iron out the more technical shortcomings 
before it gets shipped.

* We're currently not using the same communication channels, while "code-
people" (for lack of a better word) usually prefer IRC and mailinglist, these 
media are sometimes alien to "pixel-people", here we have work to do, we need 
to establish better communication channels between the groups so that input 
flows both ways in an earlier stage -- this is usually a very effective means 
to prevent communication mishaps later on. So what's a good place for code-
people to talk more with pixel-people, an the other way round?

* The last point about reviews and revisions is very well put by Eike already, 
let me reiterate here:

(b) For non-VDG developers, regressions from theme changes are just
    bugs like any other bug. Enumerating issues like that doesn't
    mean a new theme doesn't go in, it just means they're bugs to be
    fixed. Instead of feeling criticized, my recommendation to the
    VDG is that they see feedback from non-VDG developers as a
    resource: The coders on the theme know a lot about how the code
    works, which is the canvas you're trying to design to. The coders
    can help you succeed in your mission.

> When I asked both Andreas and Uri about other developers in the VDG,
> they said "only Andrew is a dev"! As I said in the conversation, I'm a
> developer, even though I don't code, nor do I design. We are all
> developers if we're working in the project. (I don't consider myself a
> Plasma devel, by the way.) We have to give ourselves the respect of
> calling ourselves developers, and give one another that respect as
> well.
> 
> All devels who contribute need developer accounts. If some of the
> designers don't have devel accounts yet, please can we get that done?

That should be easy, any active designer who doesn't have an account can 
request one and just put any of the Plasma maintainers as reference, we're 
happy to oblige.

Cheers,
-- 
sebas

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