regressions transform tool

[Timothée Giet]

Le 12/11/2014 14:00, Scott Petrovic a écrit :
> Thanks for checking that out Tim. Just to keep this conversation in 
> scope for everyone, we are referring to the scale and position sliders 
> for the free transform tool.
>
> For the position that I updated based off our conversation, it does 
> not use relative position. It still uses absolute position x/y values. 
> It just calculates the minimum and maximum values for the slider after 
> it knows what the current position is. It uses the current position as 
> the center. This concept might be too clever for people to figure out 
> if it it doesn't make sense. Position would probably be better as a 
> numeric input.
>

Ha right it's still use absolute position, but the slider limit is just 
too small.. or better it shouldn't have a limit at all, as before. So 
yep probably better to revert those and the scale ones to simple numeric 
input.

> The scale maybe the same. You mentioned the use case of flipping the 
> selection horizontally or vertically (-100%). That seems nice. Maybe 
> we could even add a couple buttons next to the scale inputs to 
> automatically do that. That seems somewhat common and would eliminate 
> typing.
>
Having some little buttons to auto-set it to -100% horizontally or 
vertically would be useful for this one common case, but can't replace 
freedom to set any value manually.

> Technically we can do whatever, but I think it would be the best to 
> design things around the most common use cases for inputs. When 
> painting, when is exact pixel control important? I never use the 
> position and scale sliders because I have never had a use for them 
> while painting. I always think visually while painting, so I always 
> use the handles for everything.
>
For reference, this can be needed when doing any work having specific 
requirements to place things at exact position (like doing a composition 
for a print work, or making consecutive tweaks on a frame sequence..)

Timo

> Scott
>
> On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 3:48 AM, Timothée Giet <animtim at gmail.com 
> <mailto:animtim at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     Hey Scott,
>
>     Thanks, I gave a try to your last changes, but it still is a big
>     usability regression to me..
>
>     As you say, " The sliders are faster, while the input allows for
>     greater control.", thing is usually when needing fast transform,
>     one would use handles rather than the docker, and only use dockers
>     numerical input for precise transforms. (at least that's how I use
>     it). So I don't really see the point in making controls in the
>     docker faster if it makes them (very) restricted compared to
>     handles. It looks prettier at first sight, but it is actually less
>     usable when thinking about what they are used for.
>
>     The sliders min/max are ok for a small number of actions, but make
>     any out-of-range transform much more tedious as they have to be
>     done in several steps, and doing boring calculations to split a
>     big transform in several ones, or rely on imprecise transform
>     (which is not an option most of the time when I need precise
>     transforms).
>     Also changing position to relative values instead of absolute
>     makes it not really possible anymore to place directly a selection
>     at a precise pixel position in the picture.
>
>     I forward the discussion on the mailing list, so we can have more
>     opinions on this problem.
>     (to the list people: read previous emails below for context ;) )
>
>     Timothée
>
>     Le 12/11/2014 01:16, Scott Petrovic a écrit :
>>     hey Tim,
>>
>>     I modified the the tools a bit and commited them to master for
>>     you to check out.
>>
>>     For the position
>>     -----------------------
>>     The position limits now change based off the current position.
>>     This is much nicer.
>>
>>     For the scale
>>     ------------------------
>>     I made it so you can add negative values up to -100%. You're
>>     'base' is at 100% now since that is that is what you should start
>>     out at. This makes flipping something vertically or horizontally
>>     much easier. If you need really large scaling, you can always use
>>     the handles. Let me know if this is better or if you have a
>>     different idea.
>>
>>     For typing in values outside the slider limit
>>     -------------------------
>>     I don't see any way currently to programmatically allow values
>>     greater than the slider limits.  If the slider only allows up to
>>     300, you can't type in 350. There might need to be some
>>     compromise with this. The sliders are faster, while the input
>>     allows for greater control.
>>
>>     let me know your thoughts on what I have done.
>>
>>     Best,
>>     Scott
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     On Tue, Nov 11, 2014 at 1:30 PM, Timothée Giet <animtim at gmail.com
>>     <mailto:animtim at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>         Hi Scott,
>>
>>         I just noticed a bad regression in transform tool caused by
>>         your UI changes:
>>         now it is not possible anymore to enter negative values for
>>         scale, which is very useful when needed.
>>
>>         In my case here I needed to use scale -100% to mirror an
>>         object precisely, which I do quite often, and discovered it
>>         doesn't work anymore. Of course it still works when grabbing
>>         the anchors, but I need to can enter numeric values for
>>         precise transformations.
>>
>>         Please fix this by moving to 0% at the center and allowing
>>         negative values on the left side, like you did for position.
>>
>>
>>         Also, on the same topic, I really think limiting position
>>         values to 3000px is not enough.. also ideally, if techically
>>         possible, it should be possible to enter manually a value
>>         that's above or below the slider limits.
>>
>>         Cheers,
>>         Timothée
>>
>>
>
>

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