[Kdenlive-devel] Where are the default project profiles?

Tue Aug 24 17:33:59 UTC 2010

On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 6:27 AM, John T. Mertz <thatonefilmguy at gmail.com> wrote:
> IMO it is better to use proper terminology, instead of shorthand for
> framerates (I.e. "29.97p" instead of "30p", "59.94i" instead of "60i"
> or "30i")

Here is what I am using for project profiles in MLT, which kdenlive uses:
$ cat src/mlt/profiles/* | grep description
description=HD 1080i 25 fps
description=HD 1080i 29.97 fps
description=HD 1080i 30 fps
description=HD 1080p 23.98 fps
description=HD 1080p 24 fps
description=HD 1080p 25 fps
description=HD 1080p 29.97 fps
description=HD 1080p 30 fps
description=HD 720p 23.98 fps
description=HD 720p 24 fps
description=HD 720p 25 fps
description=HD 720p 29.97 fps
description=HD 720p 30 fps
description=HD 720p 50 fps
description=HD 720p 59.94 fps
description=HD 720p 60 fps
description=CIF 15 fps
description=CIF NTSC
description=CIF PAL
description=CVD NTSC
description=CVD PAL
description=DV/DVD NTSC
description=DV/DVD Widescreen NTSC
description=DV/DVD PAL
description=DV/DVD Widescreen PAL
description=HDV 1440x1080p 25 fps
description=HDV 1440x1080p 29.97 fps
description=HDV 1440x1080i 25 fps
description=HDV 1440x1080i 29.97 fps
description=HD 720p 25 fps
description=HD 720p 29.97 fps
description=HD 720p 50 fps
description=HD 720p 59.94 fps
description=QCIF 15 fps
description=QCIF NTSC
description=QCIF PAL
description=QVGA 15 fps
description=QVGA 29.97 fps
description=QVGA Widescreen 29.97 fps
description=384x288 4:3 PAL
description=512x288 16:9 PAL
description=QVGA Widescreen 5 fps
description=NTSC 29.97 fps
description=VGA NTSC
description=VGA Widescreen NTSC
description=768x576 4:3 PAL
description=1024x576 16:9 PAL
description=SVCD NTSC
description=SVCD Widescreen NTSC
description=SVCD PAL
description=SVCD Widescreen PAL
description=VCD NTSC
description=VCD PAL

> This removes confusion because there is no vagueness about what the
> frame rate is, whereas if you say '30p' this could mean '29.97p' or a

There is no vagueness in the above about the frame rates; it even
includes 'fps' when NTSC/PAL is not used for SD formats.

> true 30 fps. This is less common with, say 30p, but is more critical
> for formats such as 23.98p where there is a standard for shooting both
> 23.98p or a true 24fps, so simply using shorthand '24p' instead of
> '23.98p' can be very confusing.

which is done

> My recommendations for frame rates is the following:
>
> 59.94i (for interlaced NTSC)

As you can see I am NOT using that notation partly because HDV started
going in that direction, and then other HD standards starting doing it
another way (1080i__, 720p__). Also, I am choosing to use fps over the
vertical refresh frequency. People who know and understand interlace
can easily figure out what is meant (especially when the UI spells it
out for them); novices do not and think in terms of frames.

> 29.97p (for progressive NTSC @ 30fps)
> 59.94p (for progressive NTSC @ 60fps)
>
> 23.98p (for 24p video media shot at 23.976 fps rate - most video
> cameras. In this case it is ok to abbreviate 23.976 as 23.98)
> 24p (for true 24 fps media, typically film)
>
> 50i (for interlaced PAL)
> 25p (for progressive PAL @25fps)
> 50p (for progressive PAL @50fps)
>
>
> This will make professional videographers happy :)
>
> -JTM
>
> P.S. I would never refer to 50i media as 25i, nor 59.94i media as
> 29.97i or 30i. I understand the logic behind it but this terminoligy
> is atypical.

And where do you see this?

This discussion is about conforming the Transcode profiles to the
Project profiles, and I agree with the consistency goal.

>
> On 8/23/10, Simon Eugster <simon.eu at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I noticed that in the transcode dialog we use 60i and 30p – Think we
>> should try to stay consistent there?
>>
>> 2010/8/21 Simon Eugster <simon.eu at gmail.com>:
>>> 2010/8/4 Dan Dennedy <dan at dennedy.org>:
>>>> On Wed, Aug 4, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Simon A. Eugster <simon.eu at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> On 04.08.2010 22:20, Till Theato wrote:
>>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 08/04/2010 09:38 PM, Simon A. Eugster wrote:
>>>>>>> I would like to add 1080/50i there. See:
>>>>>>> http://kdenlive.org/forum/choosing-video-profile-which-choose
>>>>>>> But where are they stored? Couldn't find anything.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Don't expect Kdenlive to reveal all its secrets ;)
>>>>>> Actually they aren't in Kdenlive at all.
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought so; git grep usually reveals such things :)
>>>>>
>>>>>> Have a look at your MLT source directory: profiles/
>>>>>> or on the system something similar to /usr/share/mlt/profiles/
>>>>>> However there is no need to add 1080/50i. HD 1080i 25fps (or
>>>>>> /usr/share/mlt/profiles/atsc_1080_50i) is the right one. "25fps" is not
>>>>>> meant to be 25i and therefore 12.5p. Sounds a bit misleading though.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there something like an official naming?
>>>>> I mean, there are 25 full frames, but 50 interlaced frames. And isn't
>>>>> the
>>>>> frame rate actually 50 fps? (A half frame every 50th second?) Because
>>>>> otherwise it would not make sense to store them interlaced.
>>>>
>>>> No, it is 50 fields per second, but the 'f' in fps means frames, and
>>>> there is 25 frame per second. I used to use Hz for the vertical
>>>> refresh rate, which is probably most correct, but I chose to dumb it
>>>> down and keep it simple for people who are not so familiar with
>>>> interlace. Those who are knowledgable should be able to understand
>>>> from both the 'fps' and the other fields that are shown when selecting
>>>> profiles.
>>>
>>> Thanks for the explanation! Clear now.
>>> http://kdenlive.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/kdenlive?view=revision&revision=4741
>>>
>>> Simon
>>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Sell apps to millions through the Intel(R) Atom(Tm) Developer Program
>> Be part of this innovative community and reach millions of netbook users
>> worldwide. Take advantage of special opportunities to increase revenue and
>> speed time-to-market. Join now, and jumpstart your future.
>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-atom-d2d
>> _______________________________________________
>> Kdenlive-devel mailing list
>> Kdenlive-devel at lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/kdenlive-devel
>>
>
> --
> Sent from my mobile device
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Sell apps to millions through the Intel(R) Atom(Tm) Developer Program
> Be part of this innovative community and reach millions of netbook users
> worldwide. Take advantage of special opportunities to increase revenue and
> speed time-to-market. Join now, and jumpstart your future.
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-atom-d2d
> _______________________________________________
> Kdenlive-devel mailing list
> Kdenlive-devel at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/kdenlive-devel
>

-- 
+-DRD-+