[Kdenlive-devel] Reinhard will be happy...

[Reinhard Amersberger]

kdenlive-devel at lists.sourceforge.net schrieb am 25.08.03 00:49:20:
> > > timeline you would be able to position via the keyboard where the next
> > > clip should go - with it automatically moving to the end of a clip that
> > > has just been added.
> > >
> > > So it's possible, stick it on the wishlist on the sourceforge project
> > > page so I don't forget ;-)
> >
> > Hhhmmm ... yes, I can do this, but ... is there really a need for this
> > keyboard cursor?
> >
> > Because I think you would need to have another viewer window that show
> > the frame at the actual keyboard cursors position ... Also you would need
> > to have specific shortcuts to move the keyboard cursor around ...
> 
> You would need shortcuts to move the keyboard cursor, but you would not need a 
> separate video window to show the position of the cursor - that is not what 
> it would be there for.
> 
> The idea is simply to allow you to select both a) which track you want the 
> next clip to go and b) where in the track the clip should go. As well as 
> allowing you to directly insert a clip from the clip monitor, it would also 
> allow you to e.g. paste a clip that has been copied from somewhere else.
> 
> The way I was thinking about it, the cursor would basically move similar to a 
> cursor in a wordprocessor, where each character is a frame, and each word is 
> a clip. If you wanted to see where the cursor currently is, well you would 
> move the seek position to be at the same place and look at it via the 
> workspace monitor.


Ok, but the advantage of an word processor is that you can _see_ the words (clips) and characters (frames) at any time.
So isn't is also done by a) selecting the track the clip should go b) position the time slider and finally c) insert the clip?
Just some good and easy to use navigation options for the time slider should be offered (like move to next/previous edge/edit/marker/inpoint/outpoint/.........), or did i missunderstood something?


> > But what about the things that are already there? I mean the In points,
> > Out points and the time slider of the timeline.
> >
> > I think maybe you just need to offer a way to specify one (or some)
> > active track(s) and the kind of how to insert the source?!?
> >
> > Just some examples:
> > Assuming having in/out points in source viewer and timeline and source
> > viewer is activated.
> >
> > Press number key "4" to do a 4-point-edit.
> > this means: the marked source area, by in/out point, will be fitted
> > between in/out point of timeline.
> >
> > Press number key "3" to do a 3-point-edit.
> > this means: the source will be inserted from in point to out point of
> > timeline beginning at in point of source viewer.
> >
> > Press number key "2" to add the source at the right side of the time
> > slider and automatically move the time slider to the end of the added
> > source clip.
> >
> > Press number key "1" to add the source at the right side of the time
> > slider without moving the time slider to the end of the added source
> > clip.
> 
> I see what you are saying. Hmmm, this is ok for inserting, but there are a few 
> issues I see. The issue of active track is glossed over a somewhat - how do 
> we choose the active track? Most likely, via some shortcut on the up/down 
> cursors (no problem with that). More tricky is the issue of inserting a 
> project clip - to set the in/outpoint for a project clip (a clip that 
> represents the entire workspace) , you will be moving the time slider when 
> you first set the in/outpoints and then again when you want to specify where 
> it should go. Is this enough of a special case to say that it is not an 
> issue? Perhaps.
> 
> ok they are minor things, but the biggest issue is : how would we select 
> clips, resize clips, etc. via the keyboard with this method, where does it 


Yes, offer non linear editing _completely_ without using the mouse isn't easy and maybe not realizable, but I think it is worth working on to live together in addition to the traditional drag & drop edit concept ;-)


> fit in? After all, after you finish your rough cut of your project, it's onto 
> lot's of tweaking, shaving off a couple of frames here, 


Okay this could be done by having this rhombus (trim) tool already suggested at source forge (RFE section). btw - this could be also called as "timeline cursors" ;-)
So user have to place this rhombuses on the timeline and hit delete will remove the footage between them (maybe based on the actual selected tracks for example).




> moving a couple of clips around there, etc. :-)


Yes, selecting clips or tracks is the biggest problem without using the mouse, especially selecting several clips/tracks! ;-)
But I think this isn't a very very very often used procedure. Mostly it is just one clip or edit which has to be moved IMHO.

So also here it would be helpful to have some shortcuts like I mentioned in another mail to change the zoom factor.
Assuming a clip is already selected it would be nice to just hold the "C" key down (just for example like _all_ others below :-) and move this whole clip using the arrows by frames.
To tweak just the right edge it would be nice to hold "ER" keys down and use the arrows to ...
To tweak just the left edge it would be nice to hold "WE" keys down (you see what I mean? E is the center key - to say it in JMB terminology - so "ER" means "Edge on the right side, because the "R" key is at the right side of the "E" key and so on ...) and use the arrows to ...
If user want to tweak the next clip he could hold the "S" key down and press the right arrow, press the up arrow to select the nearest clip in the track above, .....

Ok, assuming this would be done in standard mode so now user switch to trim mode to tweak just the edits between two clips, whereby now the edges between the clips should be automatically selected to be moved by the arrows.


Ok, _again_ just another of my workflow visions  ;-)

greetings
Reinhard