Rant: So you want help?
Patrick Spendrin
ps_ml at gmx.de
Mon Nov 8 14:01:02 CET 2010
Am 08.11.2010 12:27, schrieb Thomas Friedrichsmeier:
> On Friday 05 November 2010, Ralf Habacker wrote:
>> Am 5.11.2010 16:27, schrieb Thomas Friedrichsmeier:
>>>> The compiler discussion is old already, and it won't be solved any time
>>>> soon. So let's try to focus on the other problems first.
>>>
>>> Yeah, I know, I'm late to the party. But BTW, if I'm not mistaken this is
>>> another example of a discussion that should have been had on the list,
>>> instead of behind the scenes.
>>
>> strong words -
>> http://dot.kde.org/2007/09/18/windows-developers-meet-berlin was the
>> place where this has been discussed - i did not see you there.
>
> Well, to elaborate a bit, I'll break this up into three sub-issues:
>
> 1) The timing. I wasn't even remotely connected to the KDE on Windows project
> at that time. No matter how and where you would have discussed this, you would
> not have seen me there. I *know* I am late to the party. And I can hardly
> complain that you reached a decision at that time, and neither about which
> decision you reached, or why. I'm not trying to turn back time.
>
>
> 2) The "place" of discussion. Perhaps *at that time* the meeting in berlin
> really was a good place to decide on this. Perhaps it really allowed all
> relevant people to be there, or at least to feel represented, there. I can't
> comment on that. But I'll use strong wording again: In general, and for any
> community project, I find it presumptious to think that a physical meeting is a
> good place to reach a final decision on a core aspect like this (and one that
> was not entirely uncontroversial, as far as I understand). Core strategical
> decisions may well be *discussed*, and *prepared* on a phyiscal meeting. A
> face-to-face meeting has obvious advantages for discussion. But attending a
> physical meeting means a large investment of time (and for most: money), and
> for hobbyists with limited time, and those living far away, it is quite likely
> to be a prohibitively large investment.
>
> So if you want to allow these people to participate in decisions, then make
> sure the final words on core decisions are spoken in a forum that everybody has
> a real chance to participate in. The mailing list looks like an obvious
> choice.
>
> Now, democracy is not the be all and end all in software development. For free
> software, in particular, "the ones who do the work are the ones to decide" is
> still a golden rule. Just keep in mind that clinging to this a little too
> closely can easily end up in "the ones who decide are the only ones left
> willing to do the work".
>
> Again, I am not trying to turn back the time. The decison has been made, and
> perhaps *at that time* a physical meeting was an appropriate forum for that.
> But if you care about community partcipation, then please keep in mind that
> physical meetings (or IRC) may not always be the ideal forum for everything.
>
>
> 3) Documenting the decision. If it's a core strategical decision, and esp. if
> it keeps being brought up, then, by all means, make sure to document it
> properly and visibly.
>
> I knew that the question of supporting multiple compilers in emerge was a non-
> negotiable issue - because I happen to have touched on that spike, earlier.
> And so I did not bring this up, again.
>
> I expected that the suggestion to release binaries for only one compiler would
> be controversial. I did *not* know, or even expect that opinions are similarly
> strong, and that the discussion is similarly dead on this topic.
>
> Well, eventually, I have been told. So I have attempted to document this at
> http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/KDE_on_Windows/FAQ#Multiple_compiler_support
> . Please take a look to make sure you are ok with the way I've tried to
> summarize it.
Well, seems like you hit the bull's eye with that.
>
> And so, whenever the next fool brings up this issue, and *as soon as* the next
> fool brings up the issue, you can point them to this FAQ, and save everybody
> involved a whole lot of time and frustration. This fool, here, would have
> appreciated being told about it on or around October, 12, for instance.
Hm.
>
> Regards
> Thomas
>
>
>
regards,
Patrick
More information about the Kde-windows
mailing list