Review Request 129251: Remove Shift+Del as secondary shortcut for Cut

Tue Oct 25 14:22:37 UTC 2016

> On Okt. 24, 2016, 11 vorm., Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > -1 it's an established shortcut for cut too. even https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_keyboard_shortcuts lists it in "Cut the selection and store it in the clipboard"
> 
> Elvis Angelaccio wrote:
>     Ah, sorry I didn't know that. Still, the conflict is caused by kconfig itself and it's being worked around by applications. What should we do then?
> 
> Heiko Tietze wrote:
>     This question was asked last year on the mailing list https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-guidelines/2015-June/thread.html#877. Shift+Del dates back to the medieval ages but was never reverted and is still in our HIG. The discussion didn't end with a solution. And I strongly suggest to have a generic solution that works in all programs. Btw, Krusader uses Shift+Del for permanently delete files.
> 
> Elvis Angelaccio wrote:
>     Thanks for the link. So if I understand the issue correctly, we should first agree upon another primary shortcut for "Force Delete" and replace Shift+Del with that, at least in KConfig. What about Meta+Del like Thomas suggested?
> 
> Heiko Tietze wrote:
>     1. Do we want to retain IBM shortcuts used for decades? Yes, keep shift+del as alternative to ctrl+X; No, drop the unknown shortcut.
>     2a. If 1)=Yes, do we want to have a similar shortcut for permanently delete? Yes, meta+del/alt+del... No, use something completely different and app specific
>     2b. If 1)=No, do we want to have an easy shortcut for destructive functions? Yes, use ctrl+del for convenience. No, make it hard to unintentionally run destructive functions; rather use shift+alt+del/ctrl+alt+del or the like.
>     
>     (My take is 2b and No; but it has to work in _every_ KDE app unless the app defines its own behavior)
> 
> Albert Astals Cid wrote:
>     My suggestion is:
>     
>     * Cut is Ctrl+X and Shift+Delete by default
>     * DeleteFile is Shift+Delete by default
>     
>     **if** both Cut and DeleteFile are used in the same action collection we disable Shift+Delete from Cut (only if it's there by default and it was not the user that set it on purpose)
>     
>     That should be *doable* hopefully.
> 
> Mark Gaiser wrote:
>     I would not do that. It would be unexpected behavior when the user deletes a file (in for instance dolphin) and expects it to end up in the trash. With your suggestion it would be permanantly deleted.
>     Regardless of the shortcut, every other modern OS (win and mac) uses the delete key to "move to trash" and a <special>+delete key to permanantly remove the file.
>     
>     Lets stick to the established commands over time where Shift+del is permanent delete, not cut text. Other apps should _not_ use that key combination for a task that isn't permanently deleting something.
>     
>     Just my 2ct.
> 
> Heiko Tietze wrote:
>     Let's do a quick poll: https://plus.google.com/107566594492891737454/posts/QJzpApTeSFg
> 
> Albert Astals Cid wrote:
>     > I would not do that. It would be unexpected behavior when the user deletes a file (in for instance dolphin) and expects it to end up in the trash. With your suggestion it would be permanantly deleted.
>     
>     Why would with my suggestion end up permanently deleted instead of trash?
> 
> Albert Astals Cid wrote:
>     > Lets stick to the established commands over time where Shift+del is permanent delete
>     
>     I don't know man, i already cited wikipedia proving you wrong, what more do you want?
> 
> Luigi Toscano wrote:
>     IMHO the poll should be better placed for example on forums.kde.org, or woth some tool that does not require a google account.
>     
>     That said, even if different, we should have a global shortcut for permanent deletion as now, or we will end up with bugs to have all apps provide the same shortcut anyway.

>IMHO the poll should be better placed for example on forums.kde.org

Don't understand a quick poll like this as a final and definite survey. It's quickly done, addresses a lot of average users (guess more than on the forums or via blog->planet), and adds one more insight.

- Heiko

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On Okt. 24, 2016, 10:47 vorm., Elvis Angelaccio wrote:
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
> https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/129251/
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> 
> (Updated Okt. 24, 2016, 10:47 vorm.)
> 
> 
> Review request for KDE Frameworks, KDE Usability and Matthew Dawson.
> 
> 
> Bugs: 357747
>     https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=357747
> 
> 
> Repository: kconfig
> 
> 
> Description
> -------
> 
> This patch removes Shift+Del as secondary shortcut for the Cut action. This shortcut was set back in 2001.
> 
> Reasons for removing it:
> 
> * The expected standard behavior for this shortcut is "Permanently delete"
> * For the reason above, it is also set as primary shortcut for the `DeleteFile` action. This causes conflicts in applications.
> * For the reason above, many applications (e.g. Dolphin or Digikam) already resolve this conflict on their own.
> 
> Credits to Jan for the investigation: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=347373#c2
> 
> 
> Diffs
> -----
> 
>   src/gui/kstandardshortcut.cpp 92eb091382c7ab2110240cef21f29268be787250 
> 
> Diff: https://git.reviewboard.kde.org/r/129251/diff/
> 
> 
> Testing
> -------
> 
> Using Shift+Del in Gwenview now works as expected.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Elvis Angelaccio
> 
>

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