<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2585">Hi Boud,</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2591"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2592" dir="ltr">> And then start hacking... Thoughts? Flames?</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2593" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2860" dir="ltr">I am fully aware it is *none* of my business since I am not a developer but I have followed the Krita development since many years now...</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_5218" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3402" dir="ltr">In short, I was *truly* expecting to read this message sooner or later...</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2861" dir="ltr">At present, if you want to:</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3169" dir="ltr">- Port Krita to QT 5.5;<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2961" dir="ltr">- Port Krita to Mac (e.g. trough a Kickstarter);</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2962" dir="ltr">- Try to make Krita working fine on Windows 10 as well;</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3064" dir="ltr">- etc etc</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3285" dir="ltr">IMHO, you are forced to concentrate all your efforts on Krita...</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3401" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_3400" dir="ltr">Personally, as an open source user, I am particularly sorry for Kexi because it still greatly maintened. <br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_5635" dir="ltr">In addition, LibreOffice does not have any real interest in LibreOffice Base. As regards these past years of development, the only real new feature for Base, is the Firebird back-end which is still experimental though...</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_6786" dir="ltr">Giving how "easy" is to use PostgreSQL thanks to the GUI of Pgadmin I suppose they are right to neglect Base...</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_6653" dir="ltr"> </div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4081" dir="ltr">I do not want to sound a bit pessimistic but if you take a look a the huge LibreOffice development [1], in my view, it is unlikely for any Office - Open Source competitor to have a chance in the future [2]. <br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8001" dir="ltr">Lately they even ported LibreOffice to Gtk 3, which, in turn, AFAIK, means it
will be way easier for them to make LibreOffice work smoothly on Android as
well.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_7072" dir="ltr">I think that even Microsoft should start worrying... :-)<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_5081" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_5910" dir="ltr">Just my 2 cents (no offense meant...)</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_5925" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_6939" dir="ltr">Best regards,</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_6994" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_6995" dir="ltr">Silvio Grosso<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4667" dir="ltr"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4668" dir="ltr">[1] <a id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4810" href="https://blogs.gnome.org/uraeus/2015/08/17/an-open-letter-to-apache-foundation-and-apache-openoffice-team/">An Open Letter to Apache Foundation and Apache OpenOffice team | Christian Schaller</a><br></div><div style="width:450px; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';margin-top:5px; margin-bottom: 5px; background-color: #ffffff;" id="enhancrCard_1" class="link-enhancr-attachment link-enhancr-element " contenteditable="false"><table id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8176" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width:450px; height:auto; position: relative; display: block;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8175"><tr class="link-enhancr-element"><td class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="7" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; line-height:0px;"> </div></td></tr><tr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8178" class="link-enhancr-element"><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt;"> </div></td><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 14px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 14px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 14pt;"> </div></td><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 6pt;"> </div></td><td id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8177" rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 20px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 20px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 20pt;"> </div></td><td class="link-enhancr-element" rowspan="5" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt; border-collapse: collapse;" width="1"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt;"> </div></td></tr><tr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8174"><td id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8173" class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="2" style="width: 100%; vertical-align: middle; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8172" class="link-enhancr-text-part link-enhancr-element" style="line-height:16.5px; background-color: #ffffff; width: 414px;"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8171" class="link-enhancr-element" style="word-wrap: break-word; word-break: break-all;"><span class="link-enhancr-element icon icon-shrink link-enhancr-toggle"></span><span class="link-enhancr-element icon icon-close link-enhancr-delete"></span><a id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8170" href="https://blogs.gnome.org/uraeus/2015/08/17/an-open-letter-to-apache-foundation-and-apache-openoffice-team/" class="link-enhancr-card-urlWrapper link-enhancr-element" style="text-decoration: none !important;text-decoration:none; color: #000000 !important; line-height: 100%; font-size: 18px; display: block;"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_8169" class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-card-title" style="margin: 0; font-weight: normal;margin-bottom: 3px; font-size: 18px; line-height: 21px; max-height: 43px; color: #000000; overflow: hidden !important; display: inline-block;">An Open Letter to Apache Foundation and Apache OpenOffice team | Christian Schaller</span></a><div style="font-size: 13px; line-height: 20px; color: #999999; max-height: 81px; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';overflow: hidden;" class="link-enhancr-card-description link-enhancr-element">A couple of weeks I visited my mother back home in Norway. She had gotten a new laptop some time ago that my brother-in-law had set up for her. </div></div></div></td></tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 6pt;"></div></td></tr><tr><td class="link-enhancr-element" style="vertical-align: middle; font-family: 'Arial', 'Helvetica Neue', 'Helvetica', 'sans-serif';"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="font-size: 0pt;"><a href="https://blogs.gnome.org/uraeus/2015/08/17/an-open-letter-to-apache-foundation-and-apache-openoffice-team/" class="link-enhancr-card-url link-enhancr-element" style="color: black; text-decoration: none !important;text-decoration:none;cursor:pointer !important;" target="_blank"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4826" class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-view-on" style="display: inline-block; line-height: 11px; max-width: 314px; min-width: 254px; overflow: hidden; max-height: 13px; word-break: break-all;"><span class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-mobile-no-resize" style="vertical-align:middle; font-size: 9px; line-height: 11px; color: #999999; -moz-text-size-adjust: none; -ms-text-size-adjust: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust:none; text-size-adjust:none;">Visualizza su <span style="font-weight: bold" class="link-enhancr-view-on-domain">blogs.gnome.org</span></span></span></a></div></td><td class="link-enhancr-element" style="vertical-align: middle; width: 100px; font-family: 'Arial', 'Helvetica Neue', 'Helvetica', 'sans-serif';"><div class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-preview-wrapper" style="max-width: 100px; min-width: 80px; overflow: hidden; text-align: right; line-height: 11px; max-height: 13px; font-size: 0pt;"><span class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-preview-by link-enhancr-mobile-no-resize" style="vertical-align:middle; font-size: 9px; line-height: 11px; color: #999999; -moz-text-size-adjust: none; -ms-text-size-adjust: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust:none; text-size-adjust:none;">Anteprima per Yahoo</span></div></td></tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 9px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 9px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 9pt;"></div></td></tr><tr class="link-enhancr-element"><td class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="7" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; line-height:0px"> </div></td></tr></tbody></table></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4531" dir="ltr">[2] <a id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4532" href="https://github.com/LibreOffice/core/commits/master">LibreOffice/core</a><br></div><div style="width:450px; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';margin-top:5px; margin-bottom: 5px; background-color: #ffffff;" id="enhancrCard_0" class="link-enhancr-attachment link-enhancr-element " contenteditable="false"><table id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4676" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width:450px; height:170px; position: relative; display: block;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4675"><tr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4679" class="link-enhancr-element"><td id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4678" class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="8" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; border-collapse: collapse;"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4677" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; line-height:0px;"> </div></td></tr><tr id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4674" class="link-enhancr-element"><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt;"> </div></td><td id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4673" class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-image-wrap" rowspan="5" style="vertical-align: middle; width: 168px; height: 168px; background-color: #000000;border-collapse: collapse;"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4672" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 168px;" align="center"><a id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4671" href="https://github.com/LibreOffice/core/commits/master" class="link-enhancr-card-urlWrapper link-enhancr-element" style="text-decoration: none !important;text-decoration:none; color: #000000 !important;"><img data-id="4d69ee3d-2951-799f-dc24-8a5573eee0cd" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4670" alt="image" src="https://avatars1.githubusercontent.com/u/5824056?v=3&s=400" class="link-enhancr-thumbnail-image link-enhancr-element yahoo-ignore-inline-image" style="display: block; margin: auto;" height="168" width="168"></a></div></td><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt;"> </div></td><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 14px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 14px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 14pt;"> </div></td><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 6px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 6pt;"> </div></td><td rowspan="5" class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 20px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 20px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 20pt;"> </div></td><td class="link-enhancr-element" rowspan="5" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt; border-collapse: collapse;" width="1"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="width: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1pt;"> </div></td></tr><tr><td class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="2" style="width: 100%; vertical-align: middle; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';"><div class="link-enhancr-text-part link-enhancr-element" style="line-height:16.5px; background-color: #ffffff; height: 135px; width: 245px;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="word-wrap: break-word; word-break: break-all;"><span class="link-enhancr-element icon icon-shrink link-enhancr-toggle"></span><span class="link-enhancr-element icon icon-close link-enhancr-delete"></span><a href="https://github.com/LibreOffice/core/commits/master" class="link-enhancr-card-urlWrapper link-enhancr-element" style="text-decoration: none !important;text-decoration:none; color: #000000 !important; line-height: 100%; font-size: 18px; display: block;"><span class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-card-title" style="margin: 0; font-weight: normal;margin-bottom: 3px; font-size: 18px; line-height: 21px; max-height: 43px; color: #000000; overflow: hidden !important; display: inline-block;">LibreOffice/core</span></a><div style="font-size: 13px; line-height: 20px; color: #999999; max-height: 81px; font-family: 'Georgia', 'Times', 'Times New Roman', 'serif';overflow: hidden;" class="link-enhancr-card-description link-enhancr-element">Read-only LibreOffice core repo - no pull request</div></div></div></td></tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 4px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 4px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 4pt;"></div></td></tr><tr><td class="link-enhancr-element" style="vertical-align: middle; font-family: 'Arial', 'Helvetica Neue', 'Helvetica', 'sans-serif';"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="font-size: 0pt;"><a href="https://github.com/LibreOffice/core/commits/master" class="link-enhancr-card-url link-enhancr-element" style="color: black; text-decoration: none !important;text-decoration:none;cursor:pointer !important;" target="_blank"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_4645" class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-view-on" style="display: inline-block; line-height: 11px; max-width: 145px; min-width: 85px; overflow: hidden; max-height: 13px; word-break: break-all;"><span class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-mobile-no-resize" style="vertical-align:middle; font-size: 9px; line-height: 11px; color: #999999; -moz-text-size-adjust: none; -ms-text-size-adjust: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust:none; text-size-adjust:none;">Visualizza su <span style="font-weight: bold" class="link-enhancr-view-on-domain">github.com</span></span></span></a></div></td><td class="link-enhancr-element" style="vertical-align: middle; width: 100px; font-family: 'Arial', 'Helvetica Neue', 'Helvetica', 'sans-serif';"><div class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-preview-wrapper" style="max-width: 100px; min-width: 80px; overflow: hidden; text-align: right; line-height: 11px; max-height: 13px; font-size: 0pt;"><span class="link-enhancr-element link-enhancr-preview-by link-enhancr-mobile-no-resize" style="vertical-align:middle; font-size: 9px; line-height: 11px; color: #999999; -moz-text-size-adjust: none; -ms-text-size-adjust: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust:none; text-size-adjust:none;">Anteprima per Yahoo</span></div></td></tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 9px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 0pt; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 9px; background-color: #ffffff; font-size: 9pt;"></div></td></tr><tr class="link-enhancr-element"><td class="link-enhancr-element" colspan="8" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; border-collapse: collapse;"><div class="link-enhancr-element" style="height: 1px; background-color: #e5e5e5; font-size: 1px; line-height:0px"> </div></td></tr></tbody></table></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2565"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2508"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1440668223365_2506"><span></span></div> <br><div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div style="display: block;" class="yahoo_quoted"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> Il Giovedì 27 Agosto 2015 9:58, Boudewijn Rempt <boud@valdyas.org> ha scritto:<br> </font> </div> <blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> <br><br> <div class="y_msg_container">Hi,<br><br>We had a long discussion on #calligra yesterday, but I don't know whether<br>we came to any conclusion... There are a bunch of things we have to<br>consider before moving on after 2.9.7.<br><br>I think that the frameworks branch is now ready to be called 3.0. It's<br>obviously not ready to release to end users, but we should make it the<br>new master. But let's call it the frameworks branch for now.<br><br>I propose that we move all feature development (magnetic selection<br>tool, animation, LOD) to the frameworks branch or a branch branched off<br>frameworks at this point. From that point on, only bug fixes should<br>go into 2.9, and each bug fix should be individually forward-ported<br>to frameworks<br><br>The bigger question is, what are we going to do with the frameworks<br>branch itself and with our git repo, and with our community?<br><br>This is really hard for me, personally, to formulate, but the truth is,<br>now that I am sponsored to work on Krita, I cannot afford to spend time<br>on the rest of calligra if that doesn't directly benefit Krita. I cannot<br>refactor something in the libraries and then port sheets, because I feel<br>that would be a misuse of the money the community has donated.<br><br>With the merging of the mvc branch, I already ran into that, and found <br>that I just couldn't find the hours of the day to work on sheets, stage<br>and the rest. And apparently, nobody else could find the time.<br><br>For the frameworks branch, I do want to do a big cleanup. I want to make<br>building krita much easier, and that means cutting down on dependencies,<br>cutting down on code in libraries that krita doesn't need. On the other<br>hand, if I were the words maintainer, I would like to get rid of stuff<br>that words doesn't need, like pigment.<br><br>Originally, I envisaged our split up repo like:<br><br>calligra-libs <br>calligra-apps<br>calligra-plugins<br>krita<br>kexi<br><br>Or even split up calligra-libs into a set of repos: that would help with<br>the dependency graph in Linux distributions, where they now make marble<br>and mysql dependencies of Krita...<br><br>But in the discussion yesterday, I think we came to a sort of tentative<br>conclusion that it doesn't make sense to push all our libraries into<br>separate repositories, and that it even doesn't make sense to create a<br>separate calligra-libs.git that could be used by the applications.<br><br>I am not sure how much of the calligra libs are used by Kexi, and whether<br>sharing the same libraries between Kexi and the office applications makes<br>sense. Should kexi go into its own repo?<br><br>For Krita, and I hate to say this, it probably makes sense to fork our<br>shared libraries. The office-apps maintainers can then strip out all the<br>krita-specific stuff, and for Krita, we can strip out the stuff that only<br>makes sense for office applications.<br><br>I also think that it makes sense for Krita to integrate the karbon plugins<br>and tools, and maybe the karbon filters. I honestly don't see any future<br>for karbon as a separate application. You cannot build a good vector drawing<br>application without a dedicated maintainer, and Karbon has been officially<br>unmaintained since April 2013 already.<br><br>I'm not really happy writing this mail... But anyway, back to practical <br>issues. I'd like to start taking steps next week already.<br><br>* split up our git repo whichever we we like<br>* ask sysadmin to put our repos up<br>* update all the build documentation on community.kde.org to talk<br>about kf5 and the new repo locations<br>* update the information on our websites (not forgetting kde.org)<br>* ping David Revoy about updating his build guide<br>* figure out the release process after the split?<br><br>And then start hacking... Thoughts? Flames?<br><br>Boudewijn<br>_______________________________________________<br>Krita mailing list<br><a ymailto="mailto:kimageshop@kde.org" href="mailto:kimageshop@kde.org">kimageshop@kde.org</a><br><a href="https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop" target="_blank">https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kimageshop</a><br><br><br></div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </div></div></body></html>