<span class="gmail_quote"></span><span class="gmail_quote"></span><span class="gmail_quote"></span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">So, I hope I'm sending this letter to right address. I'm not native English speaker, so please forgive me tons of grammar errors.
</span>
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><div><span class="e" id="q_114e4de3dcf9ad41_0"><span>
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">For background information: </span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
Operating system I use is Debian -- Etch on one machine, because I like
stable and working stuff, and Testing on other, because once I wanted a
more up-to-date stuff and now there isn't a normal way to downgrade it.
</span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">[ <a href="http://wiki.debian.org/FromTestingToStable" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">http://wiki.debian.org/FromTestingToStable
</a> ]</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">I use GNOME desktop environment, not KDE, because I find it more simpler and easier to use. (I have tried to use KDE, too, but after one day (evening, actually) I switched back to GNOME.
</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">Things that annoyed me (there were more, but the most important):
</span>
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">1) Too many options, not that I didn't understand what they do, but it was very uncomfortable to navigate with keyboard. And no instant apply - while using GNOME I understood, how handy it is.
<br><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">2) Widgets on the desktop panel - by default there were installed some widgets (I can't remember which exactly), that were not useful for me. I wanted to remove some of them, then these horrible pop-ups like "are you sure?" were showed. Come on, I know what I'm doing.
<br></span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">3) So after I had customized KDE a little for my own use (1.5 hours), i felt RSI... Let me explain: I was using laptop and because of these infinity+1 different options (and not the best default ones) it wasn't very comfortable to use keyboard and since I had no usb-mouse I used touchpad. I thought it is enough for today, but ...
</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">4) .. my relative wanted to access quickly some "not-my-business" website and I opened Konqueror for him. Since he didn't wanted that I would see browsing history, he wanted to clean it, but there is no such option (I didn't find it) in Konqueror and was forced to open KControl and click "clear history" there.
<br><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">So I switched back to GNOME.</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">Actually I wanted to write about KdeEdu project. (I have actively used only KVocTrain, KWordQuiz and also KTouch, a little.)
</span><span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">As it seems no one has big interest in making KdeEdu project better. Yes the different programs are developed by their authors, some also quite actively, but project itself is stagnating (or how should I say it):
</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">1) Let's begin with the main project site [ <a href="http://edu.kde.org/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
http://edu.kde.org/</a> ]. </span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"> Couple statements from there:</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span>
<span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
1.1) </span><a style="font-family: courier new,monospace;" name="114e4de3dcf9ad41_114e4d7ef243936b_114e1520cc08f033_cp-content"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Our primary focus is on schoolchildren aged 3 to
18, and the specialized user interface needs of young users.</span> - Ye</a><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">ah, personaly I wasn't able to create list words and their translations (and learn them) without reading KVocTrain manual for a half an hour.
</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"> 1.2) </span><a style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;" name="114e4de3dcf9ad41_114e4d7ef243936b_114e1520cc08f033_cp-content">
Please see </a><a style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;" href="http://edu.kde.org/presentation/index.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">the online slideshow
</a><span style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;">
and learn about our software! - </span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">Lets see it: KDE-Edu for KDE 3.2. (KDE 3.2 released 3 February 2004, as I can read from Wikipedia).
It needs to be updated, and there could be provided links to these program websites, too.<br> 1.3) </span><span style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;">Have a look at </span><a style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;" href="http://edu.kde.org/development/3.5improvements.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
the KDE-Edu improvements for KDE 3.5</a><span style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;">.
</span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">- Ok, that is soon better, but why aren't there provided links to websites of updates programs?</span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"> </span>
<span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"> 1.4) <a href="http://edu.kde.org/stuff/information.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
http://edu.kde.org/stuff/information.php</a> -
</span><span style="font-weight: bold; font-family: courier new,monospace;">Free software is not very much used in schools or at home. Linux is even less used on the desktop.</span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
- It's sad, but I'm not wondering, see Usability.</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">2) Usability
</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"> 2.1) KdeEdu website</span><br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;">
2.1.1) Assume I want to obtain latest stable release of one KdeEdu application. Lets say khangman: <a href="http://edu.kde.org/khangman/obtain.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
http://edu.kde.org/khangman/obtain.php</a><br><br></span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span style="font-weight: bold;">KHangMan is shipped out by the distributors with the kdeedu package. Some like
</span><a style="font-weight: bold;" href="http://www.debian.org/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
Debian</a><span style="font-weight: bold;"> build separate packages for every application hosted by the KDE Edu Project. </span>- sometimes the Debian stable version is out-of-date and maybe some distribution does not have such great package management system. So I want to download the sources myself.
<br><br></span><span style="font-weight: bold;">KDE itself offers a tarball containing the sources of the kdeedu module. It can be found on the </span><a style="font-weight: bold;" href="http://www.kde.org/download/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
KDE download page
</a><span style="font-weight: bold;">. Follow the instructions in the </span><code style="font-weight: bold;">INSTALL</code><span style="font-weight: bold;"> file inside.<span style="font-weight: bold;"> </span></span> - Oh, yeah, again. Please open that page [
<a href="http://www.kde.org/download/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">http://www.kde.org/download/</a> ] and try to imagine that you are visiting first time KDE site and don't know anything about KDE project structure. And don't forget that "
<a style="font-family: courier new,monospace;" name="114e4de3dcf9ad41_114e4d7ef243936b_114e1520cc08f033_cp-content"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Our primary focus is on schoolchildren aged 3 to
18, and the specialized user interface needs of young users."</span>. <br><br>And, would somebody have actually any interest to download 28MB tarball only for one small application, especially, if he has got a slow or pay-for-every-MB connection. I personally wouldn't. 128kbps * x (seconds) = 28MB? Find x.
<br><br>The programs there have different authors anyway, so why isn't it possible to create one archive for every application (like GNOME does, see below), and one for kdeedu libraries? <br></a><span><a style="font-family: courier new,monospace;" name="114e4de3dcf9ad41_114e4d7ef243936b_114e1520cc08f033_cp-content">
<br><span style="font-style: italic;"><span style="font-weight: bold;">Good solution</span>: http://www.gnome.org/start/2.18/</span></a></span><a style="font-family: courier new,monospace; font-style: italic;" name="114e4de3dcf9ad41_114e4d7ef243936b_114e1520cc08f033_cp-content">
<br>Scroll down to "</a><span style="font-style: italic;">Building From Source". There you can easily identify what you need to download. It is easily understandable what are "Desktop Sources" and "Admin Sources". It isn't very hard to understand which one is the latest version and opening one more folder isn't also so painful. There is now a list of gnome applications/libraries and you can download that one what you exactly need.
</span><span><br><br> 2.1.2) Maybe <span style="font-weight: bold;">someone</span> was able to obtain latest stable version of khangman... He used it for a while, but then he <span style="font-weight: bold;">
discovers a very nasty and annoying bug
</span>. Of course he hopes, that somebody else will report and fix it. (I'm talking about <span style="font-style: italic;">casual (see 1.1)</span> users, not about hardcore developers). But the time passes and no one fixes it. ... Now he decides to report it (or ask for support), now he
<a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=khangman" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">searches</a> for khangman website and want to see if this bug is reported soon. --- There is no link to Bugzilla, there is no "Report bug" link. (I hope I'm not the only person who isn't smart enough to search "report bug" under "Help" menu in program..)
<br><br></span> 2.1.3) <span style="font-weight: bold;">Open source </span>- the months have been passed, user has learned programming for a while, has understood that "fix it yourself or no-one will fix it" stuff and wants to fix that bug. But he isn't so sure, if he is able to do it.
So, he wants to see source code of khangman. Why is it so hard to provide link to websvn [e.g. <a href="http://websvn.kde.org/tags/KDE/3.5.7/kdeedu/khangman/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
http://websvn.kde.org/tags/KDE/3.5.7/kdeedu/khangman/</a> ]??? For first time KDE developer it is very hard annoying process to find it. <br><br> 2.1.4) ...(there are more issues, but I could write about them later)..<br>
<br>2.2) General usability<br> 2.2.1) There is a such nice site like: <a href="http://edu.kde.org/usability/" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">
http://edu.kde.org/usability/</a> . As I understand it should show that kdeedu is so "ultimately-usable", no one writes that kdeedu suite is unusable and to on. I think just no one cares about it. I personally see also many usability issues (like navigating only with keyboard) and I think others see them too, but it is to hard to report them. So there is no one with fresh-look (any better word?), and developers don't see issues, because they are too satisfied with their own application. --- There could be provided a (link to) tutorial where is described how, and where should be these issues be reported.
<br> 2.2.2) <a href="http://edu.kde.org/contrib/kvtml.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">http://edu.kde.org/contrib/kvtml.php</a> - is there something like specification of that format? KVocTrain offers such advanced stuff as antonyms, synonyms, false positives of words, so it would be very nice if somewhere (and in easily findable place) were described how they should be marked up.
<br> 2.2.3) <a href="http://edu.kde.org/stuff/get_involved.php" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">http://edu.kde.org/stuff/get_involved.php</a> - <span style="font-weight: bold;">Many
different people will be needed to make the project a success. These
include:</span><br style="font-weight: bold;"><b style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">Parents and teachers</b><span style="font-weight: bold;"><span style="text-decoration: underline;">:</span> Feedback is needed
to to tell us what is needed, how could it be done, to test **alpha and beta**
versions and to help with the content, etc.</span> -- Above I described how hard it is to obtain *latest stable* version of a program...<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">Children</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">
:</span>
</b><span>Children, will, of course be required to help test the software.</span><b> *They can also
tell us their ideas.*</b> -- How?!? <span><br><br>(....)<br><br>I hope it's enough for the first time, and that you will understand what I meant ( and that formatting isn't too bad).<br><br></span><span style="font-weight: bold;">
P.S</span> I also have a little question: There are two similar programs in KdeEdu: KWordQuiz and KWordTrain. Both are (at least partially) developed by Peter Hedlund <
<a href="mailto:peter%20AT%20peterandlinda%20DOT%20com" target="_blank" onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)">peter AT peterandlinda DOT com</a>>. First one lacks advanced features, second one usability. But they could both have some similar features (like "endless" scrolling like in spreadsheet application, so that user doesn't need to insert rows), and, for example better "recent files" list. Implementing the same feature twice would be waste of time. Wouldn't it better to "merge" these two programs into one? Or should I report issues twice - for both programs??
<br style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span><span><span style="font-family: courier new,monospace;"></span> </span>-- <br><span>Ilja</span><br>
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